Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  
steve89

Still bad gyno!! - Caber, Reloxifene and Arimidex

Recommended Posts

Hi Guys

Gyno really getting me down now to the point where i am thinking about stopping the course 8 weeks early.

Currently running 200mg test E and 400mg tren E.

Along with 1mg arimidex eod, 60mg reloxifene ed and 1mg caber twice a week.

I have been on now for 5 weeks, i only added the arimidex 2 weeks ago, i did not think i would need it with such low test dosage but looking like i did.

I dont think it is getting worse but its not reducing and not nice to have at all.

I am not sure if i need to add more arimidex, caber or reloxifene or add anything else in?

Anybody have any thoughts?

Cheers
Ste

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Its probably not estrogen related but progesterone from the tren. And caber only helps with prolactin, and i believe prolactin is directly linked to high progesterone 

No need to add more adex you'll only crash your e2 and feel like death.

Ralox wont do shìt whilst on tren, so either drop the tren and continue with the ralox until gyno goes, or leave the ralox until you've finished your tren run and then use ralox to rid the gyno

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
26 minutes ago, bornagod said:

Its probably not estrogen related but progesterone from the tren. And caber only helps with prolactin, and i believe prolactin is directly linked to high progesterone 

No need to add more adex you'll only crash your e2 and feel like death.

Ralox wont do shìt whilst on tren, so either drop the tren and continue with the ralox until gyno goes, or leave the ralox until you've finished your tren run and then use ralox to rid the gyno

Cheers for the response mate, would upping the caber help at all then?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
34 minutes ago, bornagod said:

Its probably not estrogen related but progesterone from the tren. And caber only helps with prolactin, and i believe prolactin is directly linked to high progesterone 

No need to add more adex you'll only crash your e2 and feel like death.

Ralox wont do shìt whilst on tren, so either drop the tren and continue with the ralox until gyno goes, or leave the ralox until you've finished your tren run and then use ralox to rid the gyno

Would this apply to deca induced gyno flare up as both are 19 nors ?

Reason I ask is that ive recently added ralox because of a flare up on deca.

Only day 6 but its no different just not developing.

Ive dropped deca to 400mg test 300mg would I be best stopping ralox now until im off deca then ?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
15 minutes ago, GeordieOak70 said:

Would this apply to deca induced gyno flare up as both are 19 nors ?

Reason I ask is that ive recently added ralox because of a flare up on deca.

Only day 6 but its no different just not developing.

Ive dropped deca to 400mg test 300mg would I be best stopping ralox now until im off deca then ?

As said to you the other day mate I’ve had this convo with El Chapo. His response to to me was either put up with the flair up and reverse with ralox after cycle (which I have since done) or choose another compound 

he does the same. Reverse it that is!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Abc987 said:

As said to you the other day mate I’ve had this convo with El Chapo. His response to to me was either put up with the flair up and reverse with ralox after cycle (which I have since done) or choose another compound 

he does the same. Reverse it that is!

Yeah I just thought id run till the end of the deca and onwards so it don't get any worse then DHB time.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, GeordieOak70 said:

Yeah I just thought id run till the end of the deca and onwards so it don't get any worse then DHB time.

I see your thread earlier. You defo gonna give dhb a go? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Abc987 said:

I see your thread earlier. You defo gonna give dhb a go? 

The more I read up on it and how anabolic wise its stronger than test mast eq deca with far less possible sides yes mate defo interested.

Im scared of the pip issues though and if I buy a load and cant use it I will cry lol.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

All these gyno threads are making me super paranoid. I keep pinching my nips to see if anything is there.

Males normally have a small gland naturally right? Because I think I feel a small squishy lump, maybe half a size of a pea.

But I can't tell if that's just skin or my nipple. Visually everything looks flat and tight. But I can't stop feeling around in there.

Maybe I should stop reading all these gyno threads because it is putting all these ideas in my head.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 minutes ago, Deltz123 said:

All these meds but not nr 1 for gyno: tamoxifen. Add it in at 20mg ed

http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/canres/40/5/1750.full.pdf   if he has high prog levels , it's not a good idea. I have high prog and tamox make them itchy and burning sensations.

Raloxifen is the n°1 far away from the others , no effect on prog receptors , better for estrogen receptors , good for bones.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Baka said:

http://cancerres.aacrjournals.org/content/canres/40/5/1750.full.pdf   if he has high prog levels , it's not a good idea. I have high prog and tamox make them itchy and burning sensations.

Raloxifen is the n°1 far away from the others , no effect on prog receptors , better for estrogen receptors , good for bones.

No bloods= guessing.

nolvadex stays my nr 1 gyno med. 

He's already on ralox, caber and adex and pretty high doses of them. 

Id give nolvadex a try for at least 3 weeks at 20mg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
24 minutes ago, Deltz123 said:

No bloods= guessing.

nolvadex stays my nr 1 gyno med. 

He's already on ralox, caber and adex and pretty high doses of them. 

Id give nolvadex a try for at least 3 weeks at 20mg

yes , I aint saying nolva isn't working it worked long time ago when I had lump under a nipple.

But for hard lump gyno ralox is the best med .

He should pay for a blood work and see his levels before using nolva because if his prog is much higher then normal which I think it is , then nolva will make it worse by increasing prog receptors sensitivity 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This goes against all the broscience on these forums. What's your gyno like? Does it hurt to touch? If all that hasn't stopped your gyno from getting worse I'd drop the 19nors tbh.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

step one) crash your progesteron step two) crash your estrogen step three) up the ralox step four) hate your life but you have still those gyno free gains coming

In all seriousness @steve89 could you describe your gyno a bit more? is it a pea size lump? just on one tittie? on both? position? itching nipples?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, JakobJuice said:

step one) crash your progesteron step two) crash your estrogen step three) up the ralox step four) hate your life but you have still those gyno free gains coming

In all seriousness @steve89 could you describe your gyno a bit more? is it a pea size lump? just on one tittie? on both? position? itching nipples?

It's really hard to decrease prog , only some birth pills can 'maybe' lower them but I've read that it can also increase the sensitivity and number of receptors which is not what he wants.

Prolactin , E2 are really easy to lower , unfortunately not progesterone

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I found an old post on another forum claiming high doses of caber increase progesterone. 2mg caber a week is a lot. The last time I used it I believe it was 0.5 once or twice a week and my prolactin was completely nuked. 2-3mg of caber is already in the heart valve damage territory as well I believe. Could be wrong.

Quote

Cabergoline may be elevating it. There are studies where the use of cabergoline reduced prolactin but kicked progesterone up sky high:

Serum progesterone (g/liter)
Before cabergoline 0.33 0.09 0.36 0.18 0.37 0.17 0.36 0.16
After cabergoline 14.1 4.3 14.3 3.6 15.8 3.9 14.8 3.8


REF:
http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/95/6/2672.full.pdf

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
36 minutes ago, iamyou said:

I found an old post on another forum claiming high doses of caber increase progesterone. 2mg caber a week is a lot. The last time I used it I believe it was 0.5 once or twice a week and my prolactin was completely nuked. 2-3mg of caber is already in the heart valve damage territory as well I believe. Could be wrong.

 

it totally does , I had blood works to prove it.

0.5mg caber , took 2 times . my prog was 5 x the maximum range.

My prog is still high , which give me gyno . my E2 is low my prolactin is low.
I still don't know how to decrease it , only being totally of AAS will lower it for me

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, iamyou said:

I found an old post on another forum claiming high doses of caber increase progesterone. 2mg caber a week is a lot. The last time I used it I believe it was 0.5 once or twice a week and my prolactin was completely nuked.

 

1 hour ago, Baka said:

it totally does , I had blood works to prove it.

0.5mg caber , took 2 times . my prog was 5 x the maximum range.

 

Interesting. Then why do we even take caber with 19nors? I do it because I've always been told to. But you guys are right, caber is extremely powerful. 0.25mg x 2 a week and it completely tanks my prolactin levels. Fortunately my progesterone levels are still in range, albeit on the higher end.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, feelinfine said:

 

 

Interesting. Then why do we even take caber with 19nors? I do it because I've always been told to. But you guys are right, caber is extremely powerful. 0.25mg x 2 a week and it completely tanks my prolactin levels. Fortunately my progesterone levels are still in range, albeit on the higher end.

Because people don't know that.

the majority of AAS users think prolactin is progesterone , I would think the same if I wasn't gyno prone .

When you have 'problems' like gyno , you do everything to understand how you can have one , I made tons of research really and I still do.

 

I never use 19 nors so can't help much on that , but I think tren for exemple acts as a progestin on progesterone receptors and can increase your prolactin levels .

So , Caber will hinder the prolactin increase but won't help the progesterone levels but not everyone reacts badly to progesterone or knows that they have really high prog.

I still had good libido on 10x the normal range of progesterone , and my E2 levels weren't even visible in my blood test.. 

This means that high progesterone CAN give you effects good or bad of high E2 even if E2 is low : bloat face , gaining fat easily , gyno growth , mental sides , good/bad libido , blood pressure etc.

 

Also , long term use of tamoxifen can increase the number and size(if it means something) of progesterone receptors in the chest , making you reactive to progesterone more and give you gyno growth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Baka said:

Because people don't know that.

the majority of AAS users think prolactin is progesterone , I would think the same if I wasn't gyno prone .

When you have 'problems' like gyno , you do everything to understand how you can have one , I made tons of research really and I still do.

 

My nips get slightly puffier on cycle than when I am off cycle. It might be all in my head though because I am super paranoid about gyno. I keep pinching myself feeling for lumps even though all I feel is just skin. The more I research aas, the more I realize there is too much to account for.

Since there are very few studies done on humans, especially at doses bodybuilders use. The weirdest thing is I keep getting paranoid about having underdosed gear. Because I have very few sides, even blasting tren. I know judging by lack of sides is a poor way to gauge how strong the gear is but I keep reading all these horror stories and I have none of those sides.

It's not like you can get blood work to see serum levels of anything but test so it feels like a stab in the dark when dosing something like 19nors.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 minutes ago, feelinfine said:

 

My nips get slightly puffier on cycle than when I am off cycle. It might be all in my head though because I am super paranoid about gyno. I keep pinching myself feeling for lumps even though all I feel is just skin. The more I research aas, the more I realize there is too much to account for.

Since there are very few studies done on humans, especially at doses bodybuilders use. The weirdest thing is I keep getting paranoid about having underdosed gear. Because I have very few sides, even blasting tren. I know judging by lack of sides is a poor way to gauge how strong the gear is but I keep reading all these horror stories and I have none of those sides.

It's not like you can get blood work to see serum levels of anything but test so it feels like a stab in the dark when dosing something like 19nors.

Sides come with time .. and I'm sure you don't use high doses.

I never had sides with test / mast neither before , now I get some and I need to be careful even on low dose of test. I completely stop the mast because of hair thinning and acne.

my advice is : use low dose of compounds like test , mast , DHB 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 minutes ago, Baka said:

Sides come with time .. and I'm sure you don't use high doses.

I never had sides with test / mast neither before , now I get some and I need to be careful even on low dose of test. I completely stop the mast because of hair thinning and acne.

my advice is : use low dose of compounds like test , mast , DHB 

 

That's the problem with tren, once you try it, it is all you ever want to run. This isn't my first tren cycle. I just get warm and sweaty. Get none of that rage or paranoia that people report.

Running at 400mg per week. Tempted to increase it to 600mg just to see if the gains are that much better and to see if sides come up.

I know when to stop running tren when I get that heavy feeling. Kind of like physical fatigue and mental fogginess that lasts the entire day. Usually happens after week 10. So I keep my cycles to 10-12 weeks.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm on 500mg tren ace right now with low test and 0.5 adex EOD. Libido started declining around week 6 and some gland swelling under nips is also going on. Tren gyno is crazy. You can't even feel it coming. Mine doesn't hurt at all and after my last tren cycle it shrunk down with nolva and AI use. The problem is I really wanna stay on tren but looks like it might not be possible. I also have more water retention than I did before tren (was on eq and test only).

Gonna get prolactin, progesterone and estrogen tested on Monday. Will start caber on Monday as well and see if that helps. I know my estrogen isn't high. I know nolva doesn't help with tren gyno as I tried it last year while running tren. If AI and caber don't help either then what's left besides avoiding 19nors? This thread makes it obvious nobody really knows anything how these things work. They are just parroting the same s**t over and over again. "You don't need caber if estrogen is controlled" etc. Not that caber even helps lol. Who knows.

I love EQ but it makes me anxious. DHB is probably the same. Tren has completely done the opposite. It's a strange fearless feeling that comes with it. Masteron will make my hair fall out too fast. Primo is ridiculously expensive.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, iamyou said:

I'm on 500mg tren ace right now with low test and 0.5 adex EOD. Libido started declining around week 6 and some gland swelling under nips is also going on. Tren gyno is crazy. You can't even feel it coming. Mine doesn't hurt at all and after my last tren cycle it shrunk down with nolva and AI use. The problem is I really wanna stay on tren but looks like it might not be possible. I also have more water retention than I did before tren (was on eq and test only).

Gonna get prolactin, progesterone and estrogen tested on Monday. Will start caber on Monday as well and see if that helps. I know my estrogen isn't high. I know nolva doesn't help with tren gyno as I tried it last year while running tren. If AI and caber don't help either then what's left besides avoiding 19nors? This thread makes it obvious nobody really knows anything how these things work. They are just parroting the same s**t over and over again. "You don't need caber if estrogen is controlled" etc. Not that caber even helps lol. Who knows.

I love EQ but it makes me anxious. DHB is probably the same. Tren has completely done the opposite. It's a strange fearless feeling that comes with it. Masteron will make my hair fall out too fast. Primo is ridiculously expensive.

Sounds like me mate I ran 250mg test e 375mg tren ace beginning of the year got tren gyno flare up week 8 so ditched it cruised for short time then onto deca.

Now ive had to drop deca to 400mg from 800mg and test from 900mg to 300mg. Nolva did nothing to my gyno and now using ralox no change.

So ive got EQ and DHB coming I think im done with 19 nors unless I get my nips cut off lol.

Kinda sucks I have loads od deca and tren e and ace still but my right nip and surrounding is getting worse the more I use 19 nors.

It seems the older I get the less compounds I can use but EQ and DHB ive never used so will be fun.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

×