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Still bad gyno!! - Caber, Reloxifene and Arimidex

7K views 33 replies 12 participants last post by  Eduardo Andrade 
#1 ·
Hi Guys

Gyno really getting me down now to the point where i am thinking about stopping the course 8 weeks early.

Currently running 200mg test E and 400mg tren E.

Along with 1mg arimidex eod, 60mg reloxifene ed and 1mg caber twice a week.

I have been on now for 5 weeks, i only added the arimidex 2 weeks ago, i did not think i would need it with such low test dosage but looking like i did.

I dont think it is getting worse but its not reducing and not nice to have at all.

I am not sure if i need to add more arimidex, caber or reloxifene or add anything else in?

Anybody have any thoughts?

Cheers
Ste
 
#2 ·
Its probably not estrogen related but progesterone from the tren. And caber only helps with prolactin, and i believe prolactin is directly linked to high progesterone

No need to add more adex you'll only crash your e2 and feel like death.

Ralox wont do shìt whilst on tren, so either drop the tren and continue with the ralox until gyno goes, or leave the ralox until you've finished your tren run and then use ralox to rid the gyno
 
#3 ·
Its probably not estrogen related but progesterone from the tren. And caber only helps with prolactin, and i believe prolactin is directly linked to high progesterone

No need to add more adex you'll only crash your e2 and feel like death.

Ralox wont do shìt whilst on tren, so either drop the tren and continue with the ralox until gyno goes, or leave the ralox until you've finished your tren run and then use ralox to rid the gyno
Cheers for the response mate, would upping the caber help at all then?
 
#9 · (Edited by Moderator)
All these gyno threads are making me super paranoid. I keep pinching my nips to see if anything is there.

Males normally have a small gland naturally right? Because I think I feel a small squishy lump, maybe half a size of a pea.

But I can't tell if that's just skin or my nipple. Visually everything looks flat and tight. But I can't stop feeling around in there.

Maybe I should stop reading all these gyno threads because it is putting all these ideas in my head.
 
#16 ·
step one) crash your progesteron step two) crash your estrogen step three) up the ralox step four) hate your life but you have still those gyno free gains coming

In all seriousness @steve89 could you describe your gyno a bit more? is it a pea size lump? just on one tittie? on both? position? itching nipples?
It's really hard to decrease prog , only some birth pills can 'maybe' lower them but I've read that it can also increase the sensitivity and number of receptors which is not what he wants.

Prolactin , E2 are really easy to lower , unfortunately not progesterone
 
#17 ·
I found an old post on another forum claiming high doses of caber increase progesterone. 2mg caber a week is a lot. The last time I used it I believe it was 0.5 once or twice a week and my prolactin was completely nuked. 2-3mg of caber is already in the heart valve damage territory as well I believe. Could be wrong.

Cabergoline may be elevating it. There are studies where the use of cabergoline reduced prolactin but kicked progesterone up sky high:

Serum progesterone (g/liter)
Before cabergoline 0.33 0.09 0.36 0.18 0.37 0.17 0.36 0.16
After cabergoline 14.1 4.3 14.3 3.6 15.8 3.9 14.8 3.8

REF:
http://jcem.endojournals.org/content/95/6/2672.full.pdf
 
#24 · (Edited by Moderator)
I'm on 500mg tren ace right now with low test and 0.5 adex EOD. Libido started declining around week 6 and some gland swelling under nips is also going on. Tren gyno is crazy. You can't even feel it coming. Mine doesn't hurt at all and after my last tren cycle it shrunk down with nolva and AI use. The problem is I really wanna stay on tren but looks like it might not be possible. I also have more water retention than I did before tren (was on eq and test only).

Gonna get prolactin, progesterone and estrogen tested on Monday. Will start caber on Monday as well and see if that helps. I know my estrogen isn't high. I know nolva doesn't help with tren gyno as I tried it last year while running tren. If AI and caber don't help either then what's left besides avoiding 19nors? This thread makes it obvious nobody really knows anything how these things work. They are just parroting the same s**t over and over again. "You don't need caber if estrogen is controlled" etc. Not that caber even helps lol. Who knows.

I love EQ but it makes me anxious. DHB is probably the same. Tren has completely done the opposite. It's a strange fearless feeling that comes with it. Masteron will make my hair fall out too fast. Primo is ridiculously expensive.
 
#25 ·
I'm on 500mg tren ace right now with low test and 0.5 adex EOD. Libido started declining around week 6 and some gland swelling under nips is also going on. Tren gyno is crazy. You can't even feel it coming. Mine doesn't hurt at all and after my last tren cycle it shrunk down with nolva and AI use. The problem is I really wanna stay on tren but looks like it might not be possible. I also have more water retention than I did before tren (was on eq and test only).

Gonna get prolactin, progesterone and estrogen tested on Monday. Will start caber on Monday as well and see if that helps. I know my estrogen isn't high. I know nolva doesn't help with tren gyno as I tried it last year while running tren. If AI and caber don't help either then what's left besides avoiding 19nors? This thread makes it obvious nobody really knows anything how these things work. They are just parroting the same s**t over and over again. "You don't need caber if estrogen is controlled" etc. Not that caber even helps lol. Who knows.

I love EQ but it makes me anxious. DHB is probably the same. Tren has completely done the opposite. It's a strange fearless feeling that comes with it. Masteron will make my hair fall out too fast. Primo is ridiculously expensive.
Sounds like me mate I ran 250mg test e 375mg tren ace beginning of the year got tren gyno flare up week 8 so ditched it cruised for short time then onto deca.

Now ive had to drop deca to 400mg from 800mg and test from 900mg to 300mg. Nolva did nothing to my gyno and now using ralox no change.

So ive got EQ and DHB coming I think im done with 19 nors unless I get my nips cut off lol.

Kinda sucks I have loads od deca and tren e and ace still but my right nip and surrounding is getting worse the more I use 19 nors.

It seems the older I get the less compounds I can use but EQ and DHB ive never used so will be fun.
 
#28 · (Edited by Moderator)
If anyone's interested I got my bloods back today. Currently experiencing a tren gyno flareup and my libido is in shitter as well. Test is low and taking 0.5 adex eod on top of that. Experiencing some water retention too.

Progesterone 3,71 nmol/l (<4,11)
Estrogen 107,0 pmol/l (<146,0)
Prolactin 310 mIU/l (53-360)

Last year I had a flareup as well and got bloods done . Wasn't taking an AI.

Progesterone 11,43 nmol/l (<4,11)
Estrogen 438,4 pmol/l (<146,0)
Prolactin 316 mIU/l (53-360)

First bloods prove you can have flareups (and high prolactin?) with low estrogen. I'd feel like s**t if it was any lower. Then again maybe lowish estrogen prevents progesterone (not prolactin) from increasing because both are higher on the older bloods.

Might as well try caber for now. MAYBE low estrogen and low prolactin will be enough to stop the gyno. The worst part is it's a sneaky ****er of a gyno that you don't feel coming until you have it. No pain or anything. At least it almost completely shrunk after coming off the last time...which I don't want to fu**ing do yet.

Lowering estrogen and prolactin is easy. My guess is progesterone keeps climbing up the longer you stay on 19nors and sooner or later you're gonna have problems if you are sensitive to it. Probably also worth noting is when you have allowed the gyno to happen once it will come back very easily. My most recent bloods aren't even that high.
 
#34 · (Edited by Moderator)
Guys i'm suffering for gyno too, gyno appeared after cycling 600mg tren enan for a long time, then started using tamoxifen and gyno grew up more, was thinking it was related to prolactin, but now im off cycle running arimidex 1mg ed and caber .5mg 1x a week, and gyno not reducing, sometimes i even notice it is getting worse, you guys already spoken caber may be increasing my progesterone with makes sense since tamoxifen increases progesterone receptor's too, what's the best way to counter progesterone gyno?

maybe lowering the caber, keep the arimidex 1mg ed, and adding some letro too? saw that winstrol have anti-progestenic effects too, what u guys think?
 
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