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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
been wanting to bulk up been going to the gym for about 3 years now on and off dont really know much detail about them

was looking for info on

sustanon and decca in paricular basic info on cycle length dose ammount anything really

thanks to anyone who can help
 

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Mr Universe
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that depends on the product and make... eg sust 250 is 250mg of test/ml of oil... some other tests will be higher or lower or the same depending on what it is... deca also varies mg of deca per ml of oil depending on who makes it...
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
thanks mate i am 6ft 2 16.5 stone bit of extra weight on the belly area some people say sus helps you lose weight some people say that it would not be a good idea to jab untill the extra weight has gone what do you think
 

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Baselinez said:
thanks mate i am 6ft 2 16.5 stone bit of extra weight on the belly area some people say sus helps you lose weight some people say that it would not be a good idea to jab untill the extra weight has gone what do you think
Diet and cardio help you lose weight.

Lets get down to brass tacks.

You want to do an injectable cycle of steroids to bulk up yes?
 

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Mr Universe
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Agree with Mars here... diet and cardio (and weights) help you lose the flab... sust does not help you lose weight at all... but you can use it while doing cutting period... tbh I would recommend you dont jab till you get the training diet and all the other things in line... then if you still want to gain size read, read and then read some more before trying aas...
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
yea mate beleive me i have read read and read for countless hours about jabbing cycles diets all different roids and if its been writen down im sure i have read it im not silly enough to just start jabbing.........

i know sus wont help me lose any weight i dont want it for that pupose just dont want it to fill me with water and end up making me look worse could this happen??
 

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Baselinez said:
yea mate got sus 250 and decca in mind
Ok, you've read what the others have said and i agree.

But, if you are going to take them anyway the i would suggest you only use one compound on you're 1st cycle (thats all you need to make excellent gains) and that one compound would be sust, test e or cyp, makes no diff which one.

These can be injected once wkly at between 250-500mg per wk for 10-12wks.

Now, you will need ancilliary meds on hand before you start you're cycle, these should include nolva, clomid and an AI like arimidex, these meds will be used to control any estrogen related issues like bloating and gyno and you will also need the nolva and clomid for you're PCT, thats post cycle therapy which will help restore you're natural test production and therefore help towards keeping the gains you make while on cycle.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
thanks for the advice mate really do value it its quite hard to come across on here most people just tell you to back of and keep reading and presume im jumping straight into it....

would you say best place to jab is the glute?
 

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Baselinez said:
thanks for the advice mate really do value it its quite hard to come across on here most people just tell you to back of and keep reading and presume im jumping straight into it....

would you say best place to jab is the glute?
Glutes or quads, quads are easier for obvious reasons.

spotinjections.com
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Most anabolic steroids, especially the androgens, cause inhibition of the body's own testosterone production. When a bodybuilder comes off a steroid cycle, natural testosterone production is zero and the levels of the steroids taken in the blood are diminishing. This leaves the ratios of catabolic : anabolic hormones in the blood high, hence the body is in a state of catabolism, and, as a result, much of the muscle tissue that was gained on the cycle is now going to be lost.

Clomid stimulates the hypothalamus to, in turn stimulant the anterior pituitary gland (aka hypophysis) to release gonadotrophic hormones. The gonadotrophic hormones are follicle stimulating hormone (FSH) and luteinizing hormone (LH - aka interstitial cell stimulating hormone (ICSH)). FSH stimulates the testes to produce more testosterone, and LH stimulates them to secrete more testosterone. This feedback mechanism is known as the hypothalamic-pituitary-testes axis (HPTA), and results in an increase of the body's own testosterone production and blood levels rise, to, in part, compensate for the diminishing levels of exogenous steroids. This is vital to minimise post cycle muscle losses.

Not all steroids do cause shut down of the feedback mechanism. Everyone is different and you must also take into account how long you have been using a certain steroid and at what dose in order to determine if you need Clomid or not.

Clomid also works as an anti-oestrogen. As it's a weak synthetic oestrogen, it binds to oestrogen receptors on cells blocking them to oestrogen in the blood. This minimises the negative effects like gynecomastia and water retention that may be a result of oestrogen that has aromatised from testosterone.

It's effect as an anti-oestrogen are quite weak though, and it should not be relied upon if you are going to be using androgenic steroids that aromatise at a rapid rate, or if you are pre-disposed to gynecomastia. Arimidex and Nolvadex (Tamoxifen) are far more effective anti-oestrogens.

Important note: Clomid does not, as is often thought, stimulate the release of natural testosterone, but rather works at reducing the oestrogenic inhibition caused by the steroid cycle. It does this in a similar manner to the way it and Nolvadex block oestrogen receptors in nipples to combat gyno development, i.e. by blocking the oestrogen receptors in the hypothalamus and pituitary thus reducing the inhibition from the elevated oestrogen. This allows LH levels to return to normal, or even above normal levels, and in turn, natural testosterone levels to also normalise.

Inhibition of the HPTA is caused by either elevated androgen, oestrogen or progesterone levels. On cessation of the steroid cycle, androgen levels begin to fall and Clomid dosing is normally commenced according to the half-life of the longest acting drug in the system (see below).

This may also explain the reason individuals often find post-deca recovery more difficult, as the progesterone presence is untouched by the Clomid. We know that Clomid and Nolvadex (being very similar chemically) are both ineffective with regard to reducing progesterone related gyno, so it is reasonable to assume that Clomid has little effect against progesterone levels.

Clomid During A Cycle

When we use anabolic steroids, the level of androgens in the body rises causing the androgen receptors to become more highly activated, and through the HPTA, a signal tells our testes to stop producing testosterone. During a cycle the body has far higher than normal levels of androgens and, as long as this level is high enough, Clomid will not help to keep natural testosterone production up. It will be almost all but completely shut off, in theory.

Some heavy androgen users, however, do advocate a small burst of Clomid mid-cycle, though it must be hard for them to say if it really of any benefit, due to the amount of gear they are using. Therefore, the only purpose of Clomid during a cycle is as an anti-estrogen.

When To Start Clomid

The correct time to commence Clomid depends on the type and cycle of steroids you have been using. Different steroids have different half-lifes (indicates the time a substance diminishes in blood), and Clomid administration should be taken accordingly.

As we have seen above, Clomid taken when androgen levels in our blood are still high will be a waste. It is crucial to wait for androgen levels to fall before implementing our Clomid therapy. However, if taken too late we could possibly lose gains.

The list below determines when you should start Clomid. Select from the list any steroids you've used in your cycle and whichever one has the latest starting point is the time to commence Clomid. For example, if Dianabol, Sustanon and Winstrol were cycled, the time for administering Clomid should be 3 weeks post cycle, as Sustanon remains active in the body for the longest period of time.

Steroid Time after

last administration Length of

Clomid Cycle

Anadrol50/Anapolan50: 8 - 12 hours 3 weeks

Deca durabolan: 3 weeks 4 weeks

Dianabol: 4 - 8 hours 3 weeks

Equipoise: 17 - 21 days 3 weeks

Finajet/Trenbolone: 3 days 3 weeks

Primabolan depot: 10 - 14 days 2 weeks

Sustanon: 3 weeks 3 weeks

Testosterone Cypionate: 2 weeks 3 weeks

Testosterone Enanthate/Testaviron: 2 weeks 3 weeks

Testosterone Propionate: 3 days 3 weeks

Testosterone Suspension: 4 - 8 hours 2-3 weeks

Winstrol 8 - 12 hours 2-3 weeks

How To Take Clomid

Clomid has a long half-life (possibly 5 days), so there is no need to split up doses throughout the day. If Sustanon has been used and Clomid is commenced 3 weeks after the last injection, I would estimate that androgen levels are low enough to start sending the correct signals. If androgen levels are still a little high, we need to start at a high enough amount that will work or help, even if androgen levels are still a little high. Try 300mg on day 1; then use 100mg for the next 10 days; followed by 50mg for 10 days.

is that right thats what i have been informed???
 

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Mr Universe
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I dont mean to sound trite but a good healthy dose of common sense... if you are really panic-ie about it then you can add an aromatase inhibitor like arimidex or leterazole... or just keep nolvadex to hand in case you start feeling itchy or sensitive nipples etc...
 

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Back to basics baselinez, that article is too confusing and fails to end up anywhere, written by a novice and poses more questions than it actually answers.

Not a fan, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.
 
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