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Scientist
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Hey guys. Back with another AMA. Have been away and busy lately.

I'd like to introduce to you @ElChapo who will be part of AMA 3.0

El Chapo is a medical professional in the US that specialises as a endocrinology research nurse. He works alongside many various endocrine patients on a daily basis.

We go back a long way and he is my ONLY go to individual when I need a second opinion on performance enhancing drugs.

Fire away.
 

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Endocrine Research
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True effect of testosterone on rbc, hematocrit and cholesterol. AND effects of stating on aas use?

Really glad to see you back!
There is a highly individual and genetic response to testosterone in regards to Hematopoietic effects and changes in lipids.

The only way to know how you are affected is with lab work. Note that this effect can take +6 months to take effect due to changes in gene expression via the androgen receptor for changes in hematocrit. For changes in lipid profile, this can happen in as little as 2-4 weeks.

Many can get away with supraphyisiological levels of testosterone and maintain HCT within normal limits, other have trouble keeping levels normal even with TRT.

In this scenario, donating blood will lower HCT by up to 3%.
 

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Scientist
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Glad to be back.

Every AAS to some extent will up-regulate erythropoiesis and thus alter your haematology panel. The rate at which this happens is very individual, we have seen blood work of TRT patients on TRT dosages have their haem panels go out of whack, where as in some AAS users only a minor elevation.

AAS user will alter cholesterol without a doubt, again the rate at which it does is the same.

Statins you mean?
 

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Premium Member
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Glad to be back.

Every AAS to some extent will up-regulate erythropoiesis and thus alter your haematology panel. The rate at which this happens is very individual, we have seen blood work of TRT patients on TRT dosages have their haem panels go out of whack, where as in some AAS users only a minor elevation.

AAS user will alter cholesterol without a doubt, again the rate at which it does is the same.

Statins you mean?
Yes, sorry, will there be any negative effect on aas use while using statins to lower cholesterol?

20170601_183725.jpg.png
 

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Premium Member
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There is a highly individual and genetic response to testosterone in regards to Hematopoietic effects and changes in lipids.

The only way to know how you are affected is with lab work. Note that this effect can take +6 months to take effect due to changes in gene expression via the androgen receptor for changes in hematocrit. For changes in lipid profile, this can happen in as little as 2-4 weeks.

Many can get away with supraphyisiological levels of testosterone and maintain HCT within normal limits, other have trouble keeping levels normal even with TRT.

In this scenario, donating blood will lower HCT by up to 3%.
Thank you, I will likely give blood in the next few days. Other than that is there anything else that I can do while taking test? And what are your thoughts on low dose aspirin?
 

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Endocrine Research
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5,234 Posts
Hemapoetic changes will begin to take effect in 3 months on average, peaking after 6 months.

For lipids, you will begin to see a good amount of change in approximately 4 weeks, this too will peak in +6 months when gene expression is in full effect.

TRT doses of testosterone will not usually affect HDL in any meaningful way and tends to lower triglycerides as well. Higher doses and stronger androgens will sharply decrease HDL.
 

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Endocrine Research
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Thank you, I will likely give blood in the next few days. Other than that is there anything else that I can do while taking test? And what are your thoughts on low dose aspirin?
Your levels would not warrant a recommendation for statins. Aspirin is a good addition to a heart health stack. In fact, aspirin originated from medicinal pine bark used back in the day.

I will always recommend regular, cardiovascular exercise, as this will keep the endothelium healthy and elastic, strengthen the heart, and increase HDL. Omega 3's are also very effective as is cialis which has been shown to reverse endothelial damage in research studies. A low dose of 2.5-5 mg daily will have you covered. In regards to exercise, the trick is to find an activity that you enjoy. If you feel like a hamster on the treadmill like i do, cardio sucks. Some good ones are boxing, mma, swimming, etc.

Is this a cruise or TRT dose? What is your protocol and your goals so i can better assist you?
 

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Scientist
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Yes, sorry, will there be any negative effect on aas use while using statins to lower cholesterol?

View attachment 142542
I personally do not like statins from a research perspective. It has been shown to have many off target effects such as muscle wasting ie myopathy. I'm sure you can decide if the use of them while on AAS is good or not.
 

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Endocrine Research
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I personally do not like statins from a research perspective. It has been shown to have many off target effects such as muscle wasting ie myopathy. I'm sure you can decide if the use of them while on AAS is good or not.
Statins can cause damage to muscle cells as Ghost recon stated above, the effect is compounded if you are a carrier of the gene rs4149056 with C:C polymorphism. This will make you x 3.2 more likely to experience muscle wasting and damage from statin use.

More recent research is beginning to refute the common mantra that HLD/LDL is the end all marker for CVD. LDL particle size, intra-arterial inflammation and calcification of the arteries, etc. It's much more complex than previously stated.

Recall that in the 1800s-1900s people ate eggs, butter, steak etc. No one ever measured cholesterol profiles, but now we have an epidemic of heart disease and statins have not done much to stem the problem.
 

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Endocrine Research
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5,234 Posts
I personally do not like statins from a research perspective. It has been shown to have many off target effects such as muscle wasting ie myopathy. I'm sure you can decide if the use of them while on AAS is good or not.
If you have more labs i would love to see them.
 

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Premium Member
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Your levels would not warrant a recommendation for statins. Aspirin is a good addition to a heart health stack. In fact, aspirin originated from medicinal pine bark used back in the day.

I will always recommend regular, cardiovascular exercise, as this will keep the endothelium healthy and elastic, strengthen the heart, and increase HDL. Omega 3's are also very effective as is cialis which has been shown to reverse endothelial damage in research studies. A low dose of 2.5-5 mg daily will have you covered. In regards to exercise, the trick is to find an activity that you enjoy. If you feel like a hamster on the treadmill like i do, cardio sucks. Some good ones are boxing, mma, swimming, etc.

Is this a cruise or TRT dose? What is your protocol and your goals so i can better assist you?
I was on 500mgs Test E and 200mgs Deca per week with the goal of gaining muscle mass. My doc, who has me on trt of 100mgs Test every 2 weeks does not know I substitute that for the above. I came off everything for five weeks for labs he scheduled for me, the lab results are after the five week hiatus.

20170601_185329-1.jpg.png

20170601_183725.jpg.png
 

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Endocrine Research
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5,234 Posts
I personally do not like statins from a research perspective. It has been shown to have many off target effects such as muscle wasting ie myopathy. I'm sure you can decide if the use of them while on AAS is good or not.
I was on 500mgs Test E and 200mgs Deca per week with the goal of gaining muscle mass. My doc, who has me on trt of 100mgs Test every 2 weeks does not know I substitute that for the above. I came off everything for five weeks for labs he scheduled for me, the lab results are after the five week hiatus.

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View attachment 142547
HCT is definitely high. I would like to see that at 50% max.

How is your BP? How long do you plan on running this cycle?

Your cholesterol will come back down to normal in 4-8 weeks. HCT you will drop down by donating blood.
 

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HCT is definitely high. I would like to see that at 50% max.

How is your BP? How long do you plan on running this cycle?

Your cholesterol will come back down to normal in 4-8 weeks. HCT you will drop down by donating blood.
I have been off of everything for five weeks (specifically for the labs), I have been back on Test E 500mgs per week for just one week.

My BP has been a little elevated and my doc put me on Amlodipine 5mgs once per day. He also put me on Simvastatin 20mgs once per day. He does not know of my aas use and I'm sure he is treating the rise with standard protocol. The rest of my labs are here.

20170601_185928-1.jpg.png

20170601_185847.jpg.png

20170601_185904.jpg.png
 

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Endocrine Research
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I have been off of everything for five weeks (specifically for the labs), I have been back on Test E 500mgs per week for just one week.

My BP has been a little elevated and my doc put me on Amlodipine 5mgs once per day. He also put me on Simvastatin 20mgs once per day. He does not know of my aas use and I'm sure he is treating the rise with standard protocol. The rest of my labs are here.

View attachment 142550

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View attachment 142553
I'm glad you showed me the labs.

Your TSH indicates you suffer from subclinical hypothyroidism. Many are asymptomatic, it is however know to contribute to atherosclerosis and inflammation. Symptoms include fatigue, depression, feeling cold, trouble burning fat, facial puffiness.

Amlodipine is a fairly mild drug, do you remember your blood pressure reading?

If you are going to continue this cycle, start doing a regular cardio regimine, this will keep you healthy while you cycle. Don't worry about it limiting your muscle gains as the increased efficiency in your cardiovascular system will enhance your training by enhancing blood flow and oxygenation to the muscles and increase metabolic byproduct clearance (lactic acid, etc), just dont overdue it.
 

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Endocrine Research
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5,234 Posts
I like to remain anonymous on here. Ask @ElChapo how I look.
We would be considered jacked by any standard.

I would post pictures, but US law is draconian when AAS comes into play and i value my occupation and anonymity too much.

It won't change the accuracy of our answers or the depth of the information provided herein :)
 
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