Bulldozer

This sort of training wont give you a "pretty" body . If you wanna call it that.

But regardless it is how most strength althletes train. This is fact.

A lot of strongmen/ powerlifters have more muscle on there frame than shawn ray could have ever dreamed of. Just covered with a layer of fat thats all.

If more Bodtbuilders trained like Powerlifters (at least to start with) there would be more big guys around IMO.

Most aspiring BB train with too much volume and too many isolations, thats why the boards are full of threads asking for advice on gaining mass.


Train smarter , not harder. Train twice as hard on half the volume and most would do better imo.

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ah24

There's always going to be 2 sides of the coin though.

I recommend once out of the beginners stages going into 'BBers' workouts, isolation exercises etc.....I've done well off it so far (I like to think lol) but then you obviously have great gains with this type of training. Everyones different so its more a case of find what suits you.

At the moment I've gone upto training 5 days a week....I can just see you, nytol and big fainting at your computers

I train each bodypart twice a week except arms and calves which get trained once..Split into 'power' and 'hypertrophy' workouts.

mon = upper body (strength 3-6reps......compounds only and low volume)
tues = lower body (same as above)
weds = off
thurs = chest/back (hypertrophy 8-12)
fri = legs (12-15)
sat = shoulders/arms (8-12)
sun = off

2 things about this, firstly I'm a believer that if your protein intake and water intake is optimum and coupled with proper rest you can recover perfectly well.

Secondly, it may not work - but what have I lost by giving it a go? I seem to be fine at the moment on it.

Quite a few guys say people go on about 4 day splits all the time on message boards etc but IMO, at the moment, more people are preaching about over-training and should do 2 day splits etc much more than those recommending 4 day splits.

I think too much emphasis is focused on overtraining and think many people actually undertrain.

TH&S

How are you periodising your routines...?

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D: 220 | B: 140 | S: 210

bigden

i agree the thickness and density of powerlifters mucles are just immense and plus i prefer the powerlifter look to the all out bber look tbh

trickymicky69

this sounds very much like the routine i have been training with for the last year.
i also attribute my strength to the simplicity of it all, which although not amazing is still very good for an 80kger.
i train like this

mon - 2 warm up sets bench
4x6 flat bench
2 warm up sets squats
4x6 squats

wed - 2 warm up sets deadlift
4x6 deadlift
2 warmup sets barbell rows
4x6 barbell rows

fri - 2 warm up sets dips
4x8 weighted dips
2 warm up sets squats
4x10 squats

and if i feel like really going mad i might do a few sit ups but thats it. i have put on around 8kgs in a year doing it like this. much more than i ever did bodybuilding and i hardly ever take a week off. when bbing i needed a week off every couple of months

simba

i still dont agree.. if thats the case ..than why would jonnie jackson..wanna train like a bodybuilder.. or ronnie ?

show me a power lifter who can match shawn ray ?

his record speaks for it self..

they are two different sports...leave it at that...

but if u find it works for you ...great...

god bless

TH&S

In terms of...?

Muscle mass...?

Power/Strength...?

Asthetics...?

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D: 220 | B: 140 | S: 210

Bulldozer

Yes they are 2 different sports and your the one who made the comparison to start with bud, not me

Im not talking about guys who use boat loads of gear, peptides and site enhancment oils (and dont kid yaself, the pro's do use them) and have great genetics. (guys such as Ray) That is the far end of the scale.

Im talking about the average joe wanting to bulk up and build lean body mass. Not step on stage!! But to actually build some mass. IMO PL style routines are more effective at this than BB routines. At least for the begginer/intermediate trainer.

This board and others like it are full of threads started by guys who have recently started BB (last year or so) and looking to gain mass, but finding it difficult. They post up there training and surprize, surprize they are doing a typical BB routine, 3 or 4 day split, training each bodypart once a week using 8 to 12 sets a bodypart. Hitting the muscle from all angles, blah blah blah, yada yada yada.

Now show me a thread when a guy has just started BB and is having trouble gaining mass with a training program that concentrates on squats, deads, bench, ohp and heavy rowing for example. Training 2 or 3 times a week using only basic movements with maybe a 5x5 rep range and concentrating on getting stronger , In other words training more like a powerlifter would.

I have been on the boards for about 18 months, i post on atleast 10 boards and have read thousands of threads and have yet to see the later, but have seen hundereds of the former. Just an example of what im talking about

Im not saying BB techniques dont work for some people. (they obviously do) But high volume and high frequency training doesnt work for a lot of guys. Especially while training drug free (which i hope a guy with only a year or so of experience would be)

IMO , as i said earlier in the thread. To start off with i believe you should build a solid strength foundation before you make a switch to hypothropy based training.

Look at some of the best BB of all time, franco, arnold, ronnie to name just a few, they all started out as powerlifters. They built the foundation and then made the switch to bodybuilding.

In other words train more like a powerlifter to start. Also anyone that thinks that low rep training doesnt build muscle is deluded .

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Bulldozer

Exactly lol

Its like comparing apples and oranges

Shaun Ray VZ mariusz pudzianowski

Muscle mass , i take mariusz

power/strength mariusz

asthetics Ray

I win 2-1 :love:

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TH&S

Quality post bully. Quality.

Volume/Hypertrophy training isn't for the trainees who have 'recently' started their training (unless they are doing it under supervision with a trainer who is monitoring their progress on a weekly basis) - and that is something which is missed out when routines like that are published on the net/in magazines.

PL style training - or if you like focussing on the basics - is IMHO the best way forward when starting training, and its certainly has its place and should be used even when people beleive they have broken out of that 'beginners' label.

+1 Sir.

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D: 220 | B: 140 | S: 210

chrisj22

I've trained 5 days a week, I've trained 4 days a week, I've even trained 3 days a week, but it's down to the individual & how they adapt. I train twice a week, & yes, I follow compound movements because nobody can deny that lifting heavy weight (with textbook form) builds muscle.

It's all about trial & error TBH. I get overtrained very easily & I'm not being a big girl trying to 'tell myself' I'm overtraining, I know when I'm overtraining. I don't want to train when I'm overtrained, I hate the thought of going to the gym, I'm always fatigued - now why would I think like that when I love training?? Why wouyld I not want to train when I've been doing it for 5 years??

I know for sure that my intensity has increased by about 30% going twice a week because I feel fresh & raring to go. It's all swings & roundabouts.

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ONE SMART COOKIE

To read later......

If I have time & it interests me for long enough to finish.....

Chris4Pez

Well at the minute i have to agree with the fact that training like a power-lifter first is the best thing and i am only glad that i have realized this earlier rather than later!

I have been looking over this after being told about it and TBH after Christmas my training is going to change to PL rather than the classic BB!

I watch a lot of the DVDs by the pro's and also read a lot of the books and ebooks and TBH a lot of the big stars who are now in BB said that they started doing power-lifting rather than BB and their bodies are probably a lot better than others and they place fairly well in contests when they compete!

What i say is give this sort of training ago, (making sure you keep proper STRICT technique) and see what happens, if you dont gain you have lost nothing, but if it does work then you have gained everything and remember you can always lose BF later when "cutting" by reducing calories and doing cardio!

simba

mariusz used to be a bodybuilder before he took up strong man...

Bulldozer

I only used mariusz as an example.

But if he used to be a bodybuilder thats a new one on me and quite frankly i doubt that. (but could be wrong lol)

From wikapedia

Background
Mariusz maintains his agility, conditioning, and general physical preparedness through other athletic endeavors. He is a practitioner of Kyokushin karate (fourth kyu), which he has been practicing between the age of 11 to 13 (later between the age of 26-27). He was also a competitive boxer for seven years (1992-1999), three of which were spent in the Kosedowski League. Mariusz is a favorite in every strongman competition he enters, having been defeated only twice in Poland through 2002, with his worst placing being a respectable second.
Pudzianowski's father was also a large w