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Martin Berkhan VS Lyle McDonald

49 posts in this topic

Posted

I have/had a lot of respect for both these guys, Martin seemed to go off the rails a while back and lyle has just joined him.

The ego is a powerful thing!

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Posted

I'm friends with Lyle on Facebook. He has always been that much of douche bag. At least he is honest about it all. And I'd trust his nutrition information over martin who has been pushing an agenda with an impartia view for far too long. Shame as i used to like him.

It seems everyone in the nutritional industry goes mental in the end no matter how well they start

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Posted

I'm friends with Lyle on Facebook. He has always been that much of douche bag. At least he is honest about it all. And I'd trust his nutrition information over martin who has been pushing an agenda with an impartia view for far too long. Shame as i used to like him.

It seems everyone in the nutritional industry goes mental in the end no matter how well they start

Yeah they are two people who I have respect for but it baffles me that it has come to this. This community should be about sharing ideas and experiences but it isn't unfortunately. It's popular to "call someone out" as they say. Well that works as it gets you lots of attention which is what they want of course, it's just a shame it's so negative when bodybuilding is a positive sport - it's about determination, taking control, and changing your life for the better.

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Posted

It seems everyone in the nutritional industry goes mental in the end no matter how well they start

I think it could have something to do with the wacky diets they push, makes the brain go funny.

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Posted

That really is pathetic. I always knew that Lyle had a hot temper, but jeez...

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Posted

Martin was even slating Alan Aragon for no reason lol

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Posted

Shame. Lyle Mcdonald is a jedi knight in this field. Martin Berkhan is smart as fcuk. They both lie on the side of the fence that casts off bullsh1t and nutritional superstition. Its a crying shame they are not seeing eye to eye on things anymore.

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Posted

Give them a break, just human nature - they are just ordinary people prone to the same moments of ego, bitchiness, closed-mindedness and error as anyone else.

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Posted

I'm friends with Lyle on Facebook. He has always been that much of douche bag. At least he is honest about it all. And I'd trust his nutrition information over martin who has been pushing an agenda with an impartia view for far too long. Shame as i used to like him.

It seems everyone in the nutritional industry goes mental in the end no matter how well they start

Simon - could you please clarify what you mean in the part I put in bold?

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Posted

Don't know if its part of what Simon ment but with Martin he preaches how he's the only one in this to not make money a bit too often IMO :D

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Posted

Simon - could you please clarify what you mean in the part I put in bold?

Don't know if its part of what Simon ment but with Martin he preaches how he's the only one in this to not make money a bit too often IMO :D

not really Mutant, but i guess its a valid point.

For the record I do IF when cutting. It's a great tool to have the box.

What I referring to is Martin has built a career out of publishing every little bit of information that can pin to his methodologies. Regardless if they are terrible studies with bad methods or just broscience. Don't get me wrong, he has a lot of good stuff busting other bro-science which I respect. But some of his supporting documents are flimsey and he knows it. I haven't been on his site for a bout a year, but before then I had read every single article on that site, probably several times. Rather than be impartial and objective, he ignores rationale and constructive objections and sticks to his guns.

Which in all fairness I can appreciate, he is selling a product/services and it makes commercial sense to push an agenda. But I am not in this for the money and i'm the quest for truth and honesty category.

I unfriended Lyle yesterday too. I've got bored of his abusive and paranoid ramblings. He has become the male equivalent of an old cat lady. He spends more time abusing people on facebook than a 13 year old with ADHD. He also never writes much about nutrition on there. The reason i added him

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Posted

I unfriended Lyle yesterday too. I've got bored of his abusive and paranoid ramblings. He has become the male equivalent of an old cat lady. He spends more time abusing people on facebook than a 13 year old with ADHD. He also never writes much about nutrition on there. The reason i added him

I think [MENTION=70816]IGotTekkers[/MENTION] here had a fight with him facebook before and Lyle went really childish

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Posted

not really Mutant, but i guess its a valid point.

For the record I do IF when cutting. It's a great tool to have the box.

What I referring to is Martin has built a career out of publishing every little bit of information that can pin to his methodologies. Regardless if they are terrible studies with bad methods or just broscience. Don't get me wrong, he has a lot of good stuff busting other bro-science which I respect. But some of his supporting documents are flimsey and he knows it. I haven't been on his site for a bout a year, but before then I had read every single article on that site, probably several times. Rather than be impartial and objective, he ignores rationale and constructive objections and sticks to his guns.

Which in all fairness I can appreciate, he is selling a product/services and it makes commercial sense to push an agenda. But I am not in this for the money and i'm the quest for truth and honesty category.

I unfriended Lyle yesterday too. I've got bored of his abusive and paranoid ramblings. He has become the male equivalent of an old cat lady. He spends more time abusing people on facebook than a 13 year old with ADHD. He also never writes much about nutrition on there. The reason i added him

That was an interesting read.

But reading between the lines, are you essentially saying that there is flawed science in the IF approach which Berkhan chooses to ignore?

Regarding Lyle McDonald, I agree that he comes across as a bit of a d1ck quite frequently. However in his defence I'm pretty sure that he has mental health issues. I don't mean that as a personal attack on him but rather as a statement of fact. He suffers/has suffered from really bad depression. He is a big animal rights supporter and in my book that means that he can't be an entirely negative person.

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Posted

That was an interesting read.

But reading between the lines, are you essentially saying that there is flawed science in the IF approach which Berkhan chooses to ignore?

Regarding Lyle McDonald, I agree that he comes across as a bit of a d1ck quite frequently. However in his defence I'm pretty sure that he has mental health issues. I don't mean that as a personal attack on him but rather as a statement of fact. He suffers/has suffered from really bad depression. He is a big animal rights supporter and in my book that means that he can't be an entirely negative person.

There are tons of flaws in the studies that he posts. There are also loads of really good ones.

The only scientifically PROVEN fact about why IF works is calorie deficit. It helps control calories. Nothing more, nothing less.

I find it helps with energy levels too, but that is merely a widely reported anecdotal experience with scientific theory to back it up. In the same respect, i've seen quite a few similar studies that say the same thing about eating a big breakfast. Which has just as much validity. So you need to be objective.

But being objective doesn't include ignoring the articles that don't fit your argument and waving around the ones that do.

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Posted

I think [MENTION=70816]IGotTekkers[/MENTION] here had a fight with him facebook before and Lyle went really childish

Yep, the kid is an absolute biatch. I beat him intellectually so many times in public he had to remove me as a friend. He is one of those that walks in like a big man, gets owned, and walks away calling for mum. I have no respect for the tosspot whatsoever even if I do agree with a lot of his nutritional smarts.

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Posted

I've been IF'ing for about 2 years now. Done it for so long because i just got used to eating that way. Used it for both cutting and bulking. In the past week i have gone back to eating 'normally'. To be honest IF made fvck all difference whatever my goals were.

I have come to my own conclusion that you can eat whenever and whatever you want as long as it matches what your daily kcals and macros are, fvcking around with timings and sh1t really doesnt matter.

Eat healthy, lift weights, live healthy, have fun and treat yourself now and again is the best 'lifestyle' and 'diet' you can do.

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Posted

Lyle McDonald really has quite a background though, being a former collaborator of the great Dan Duchaine. Years ago, before he started writing books, he trialled Duchaine's BodyOpus program and wrote a very detailed journal of his experiences. He proved himself very scientifically adept and apparently even Duchaine conceded that Lyle understood his BodyOpus better than he did himself.

It really is a shame that he has become so bitter and twisted.

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Posted

I've been IF'ing for about 2 years now. Done it for so long because i just got used to eating that way. Used it for both cutting and bulking. In the past week i have gone back to eating 'normally'. To be honest IF made fvck all difference whatever my goals were.

I have come to my own conclusion that you can eat whenever and whatever you want as long as it matches what your daily kcals and macros are, fvcking around with timings and sh1t really doesnt matter.

Eat healthy, lift weights, live healthy, have fun and treat yourself now and again is the best 'lifestyle' and 'diet' you can do.

So. Much. This. ^^^^^^

unfortunately too many people want a magic pill, 'super foods' or secret formula to convince them that they are being 100% committed or hardcore.

People spend more effort on convincing themselves that meal timing, keto or chicken n sweet potatoes or IF is the 'final missing piece of the puzzle" rather than reading up from an objective point of view and realizing it matters very little

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Posted

In my humble opinion one of the most common errors (at least to my mind) which many on here make is that they follow diets which are so damn bland that it's unbelievable. Apart from the sheer monotony, I'm sure that the lack of variety also leads to a lack of complete nutrition from micronutrients.

I realise that time is a constraint for most of us which may limit choices for the first few meals of the day until we're home from work. But at least once a day it's worth spending slightly longer in the kitchen to actually make something worth eating. So many nice great things to eat which are fully compatible with our bodybuilder diets.

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Posted

In my humble opinion one of the most common errors (at least to my mind) which many on here make is that they follow diets which are so damn bland that it's unbelievable. Apart from the sheer monotony, I'm sure that the lack of variety also leads to a lack of complete nutrition from micronutrients.

I realise that time is a constraint for most of us which may limit choices for the first few meals of the day until we're home from work. But at least once a day it's worth spending slightly longer in the kitchen to actually make something worth eating. So many nice great things to eat which are fully compatible with our bodybuilder diets.

There's that phrase again "bodybuilder diet" :lol:

i love cooking, i find it stress reliving and rewarding

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Posted

There's that phrase again "bodybuilder diet" :lol:

i love cooking, i find it stress reliving and rewarding

I agree - the terminology kind of sucks lol.

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Posted

That was an interesting read.

But reading between the lines, are you essentially saying that there is flawed science in the IF approach which Berkhan chooses to ignore?

I think [MENTION=3779]Learney[/MENTION] was subtly referring to that in this article: http://www.phillearney.com/nutrition/intermittent-fasting-a-discussion/

Fasting and Intermittent fasting as a dietary method has been something we’ve seen an awful lot about as of late and if I’m honest some great data and studies to support it. Shame that the one site I’ve seen heavily promoting it as a method uses a LOT of VERY indirect studies that have a loose association with the subject. Infact I read a few of the references and they where downright bad for what was trying to be validated tbh. But anyways

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Posted

So. Much. This. ^^^^^^

unfortunately too many people want a magic pill, 'super foods' or secret formula to convince them that they are being 100% committed or hardcore.

People spend more effort on convincing themselves that meal timing, keto or chicken n sweet potatoes or IF is the 'final missing piece of the puzzle" rather than reading up from an objective point of view and realizing it matters very little

I do IF but I really see it a 'lifestyle diet' rather than something that's going to give you that edge in terms of body fat. It just is an easier way to live as you don't have to think about food all of the time (though I do haha) and having that 8hr window means I eat less and I feel much more in control. I don't imagine I'll do this forever but for the moment it works for me.

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