should I rely on protein powders? - UK-Muscle Body Building Community

**Jimmy** · 04-01-2005, 05:40 PM

Hi folks,

I was asked once a very good question regarding why I advise against supplementing protein powders in high amounts. Now this got me thinking and I decided to write my opinions for others to read and think for themselves.

I would like to say that this is only my view on the subject and in no way am I telling people that I have hard scientific evidence to back up my thoughts. So as I said before, this post is designed to make others think a little instead of listening to all the data shoved at us by supps companies and taking it for granted that they are correct.

My theories are all based on trial and error in bodybuilding and even if I learn something new, I will try it before I agree/disagree with it because proof is in the pudding.

I believe that people place too much trust in protein supplements as opposed to the whole food option.

Now I agree with protein powders PWO mainly cos I would yak if I ate more than a few rice cakes and fruit at this time! Chicken and rice is out of the Q here but I have used blended tuna and fruit PWO.

The only other time I use whey is if I miss a meal or cant possably eat food due to inconveinience ( Which is not very often )

There are two reasons why I opt for whole food.

The first is that in 11 years of training I've used every single fad supplement going ( anyone remember cybergenics LOL? ) I dont think I can credit an ounce of mass to using supplementss. I've gone from no food and supplements only!!!!, to all whole food and no supplements.

I agree that using supplemented protein powders only is extreme and that no one here ever trys this but never the less, I shrunk LOL Stupid young lad!

I went through periods where I used 3-4 meals and 3-4 drinks and when I eliminated the shakes I noticed no loss of mass. Similarly when I started to use the drinks again I experienced no increase in mass either!

The second reason, one that I have posted before was learned during my diet.

My diet plan for last years show consisted of one food meal followed by one supplement meal, and so on... When the diet started to bite I went hypoglycemic after the supplement meals but never after the food meals.

Near to the show all my foods changed to solids and not only did I feel like a new man, but the quality of my appearance improved dramatically!! This spoke volumes to me and if supplements were no good to me dieting, then why would they be bulking.

I now use whole food only and am growing faster than ever guys, whole food IMO works better, period.

I think a lot of the high protein theories are concocted by supplement companies that want to sell! They tell us that we need X amount of protein per day that is sooooo high that we could only consume this derived of food and supplements combined.

I am in close assosiation with a partner in a supplement company and he only eats whole food as well. He even told me once to cut back my supplement intake to PWO and inconveinient times! Now what could he possably have to gain by this?

IMO 400g of protein 70/30 food to powder works no better than 300g whole food only!

I agree that its hard for newbies to eat so much but IMO they will gain a lot on a little anyway. Thats why I always recomend they start at 3-4 whole food meals containing quality P,C&F ( which lets face it, in this day and age is nearly always an improvement on their current diets ). When they are used to this and their apetites/stomachs have stretched, they can then increas by a meal at a time.

I also feel that supps these days are very over priced for the benefit they give, which is disheartening for young guys aspiring to Ronnie or Jay, thinking that a tub with the picture of a pro on will make them that big too!!! I remember my first tub of protabelise EM by a company called Cybergenics. It was supposed to be designed specifically for a mesomorph...yeh right! It cost over £20= and I hoped I would only need to take for a year or so to get to 16 stone or so and then I could stop spending out LOL LOL

I am constantly on the go as well guys, it just takes a little thinking to get around this problem. Where there is a wiil, there's a way!!! If food is generally accepted as better than powder, then work out some way to beat the problem!!

You all have read my daynas smoothie post?

http://www.biohazardforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=2001

Well it is just as quick to drink as whey and DOES taste nice if made correctly!

I also make a drink made of 6 eggs, whisked then microwaved for 20-30 seconds and mixed with a little whey, water and sweetener. This is just as quick to drink.

I still maintain that most people can eat at least every 3 hours with a tablespoon of whey in between to top the amino pool if they really want to. Is it that most people are lazy in this day and age, not taking the time to prepare their meals the night before and put them in tupperware's LOL?

If the newbies here could get 150g from whole food ( which isnt hard IMO ), then 50g PWO from whey or the like, then they are eating pretty much what they need!! If they then want extra Kcals from a conveinient source, then drink some maltodextrine with squash for taste. Whey IMO is still overpriced because even though gram for gram, its cheaper than food, it still doesnt bennefit us in growth as well as food. If it doesnt make us grow as well as food then we are wasting our money! If it doesnt make us grow as well as food, and we still use it, then we are cheating ourselves!

I can understand it when a 22stone lump (and I know a few who do this) is eating 2 turkey breasts with 100g rice and 2 cans of tuna mixed in every 3 hours. These guys need to use whey etc cos they cant eat any more! Can the rest of us really say that we cant physically eat more, or again is it stubborn or laziness.

I am in no way saying that everyone is lazy, or arnt serious about nutrition, instead I'm asking people to really think if they can push themselves that little bit more, to get the most from real food because at the end of the day, its them that benefits.

Ok rant over, my last comment is that suups are supps, thats why they are called supps!! Still following me?..Good. They should never be used to replace a meal which is what I see all the time in diets. If people must use them then IMO whole food every 3 hours with 15-20g of whey sneaked in between may help top up aminos.

So one last thought for you all to ponder upon. If you were on a desert island for bodybuilders only, and were offerd 100kg of steak, or 100kg of whey, which would you choose to consume? I know whay I would choose for sure!

**robdog** · 04-01-2005, 08:52 PM

Another excellent read mate.

**Jimmy** · 05-01-2005, 06:48 PM

cheers rob

i know your humoring me as you have read them already!!!!

**robdog** · 05-01-2005, 07:04 PM

LOL i have read them all yes mate but still it doesnt hurt to reread them.

jas uk · 05-01-2005, 07:04 PM

Only new to this diet lark but when I thought about buying shakes I realised that if I eat something it would feel better than a liquid meal.So I think when cutting food will fill you up ,and when bulking meat ,eggs or whatever will contian more cals than a shake in water +its easier to add carbs and fats to a meal.

trickymicky69 · 08-01-2005, 07:43 PM

deffo gonna try that shake recipe. quality protein shake for the price of six eggs? whats that 60p? cheap as fookin chips jimmy lad

08-01-2005, 07:47 PM

food is the main supplement any bodybuilder/powerlifter/strongman needs i keep the whey for if i aint got time to eat, of for post work, apart from that u cant beat good old FOOD

04-01-2005, 05:40 PM	#1 (permalink)
Jimmy Super Moderator Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Forest gym crawley Posts: 4,301	should I rely on protein powders? Hi folks, I was asked once a very good question regarding why I advise against supplementing protein powders in high amounts. Now this got me thinking and I decided to write my opinions for others to read and think for themselves. I would like to say that this is only my view on the subject and in no way am I telling people that I have hard scientific evidence to back up my thoughts. So as I said before, this post is designed to make others think a little instead of listening to all the data shoved at us by supps companies and taking it for granted that they are correct. My theories are all based on trial and error in bodybuilding and even if I learn something new, I will try it before I agree/disagree with it because proof is in the pudding. I believe that people place too much trust in protein supplements as opposed to the whole food option. Now I agree with protein powders PWO mainly cos I would yak if I ate more than a few rice cakes and fruit at this time! Chicken and rice is out of the Q here but I have used blended tuna and fruit PWO. The only other time I use whey is if I miss a meal or cant possably eat food due to inconveinience ( Which is not very often ) There are two reasons why I opt for whole food. The first is that in 11 years of training I've used every single fad supplement going ( anyone remember cybergenics LOL? ) I dont think I can credit an ounce of mass to using supplementss. I've gone from no food and supplements only!!!!, to all whole food and no supplements. I agree that using supplemented protein powders only is extreme and that no one here ever trys this but never the less, I shrunk LOL Stupid young lad! I went through periods where I used 3-4 meals and 3-4 drinks and when I eliminated the shakes I noticed no loss of mass. Similarly when I started to use the drinks again I experienced no increase in mass either! The second reason, one that I have posted before was learned during my diet. My diet plan for last years show consisted of one food meal followed by one supplement meal, and so on... When the diet started to bite I went hypoglycemic after the supplement meals but never after the food meals. Near to the show all my foods changed to solids and not only did I feel like a new man, but the quality of my appearance improved dramatically!! This spoke volumes to me and if supplements were no good to me dieting, then why would they be bulking. I now use whole food only and am growing faster than ever guys, whole food IMO works better, period. I think a lot of the high protein theories are concocted by supplement companies that want to sell! They tell us that we need X amount of protein per day that is sooooo high that we could only consume this derived of food and supplements combined. I am in close assosiation with a partner in a supplement company and he only eats whole food as well. He even told me once to cut back my supplement intake to PWO and inconveinient times! Now what could he possably have to gain by this? IMO 400g of protein 70/30 food to powder works no better than 300g whole food only! I agree that its hard for newbies to eat so much but IMO they will gain a lot on a little anyway. Thats why I always recomend they start at 3-4 whole food meals containing quality P,C&F ( which lets face it, in this day and age is nearly always an improvement on their current diets ). When they are used to this and their apetites/stomachs have stretched, they can then increas by a meal at a time. I also feel that supps these days are very over priced for the benefit they give, which is disheartening for young guys aspiring to Ronnie or Jay, thinking that a tub with the picture of a pro on will make them that big too!!! I remember my first tub of protabelise EM by a company called Cybergenics. It was supposed to be designed specifically for a mesomorph...yeh right! It cost over £20= and I hoped I would only need to take for a year or so to get to 16 stone or so and then I could stop spending out LOL LOL I am constantly on the go as well guys, it just takes a little thinking to get around this problem. Where there is a wiil, there's a way!!! If food is generally accepted as better than powder, then work out some way to beat the problem!! You all have read my daynas smoothie post? http://www.biohazardforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=2001 Well it is just as quick to drink as whey and DOES taste nice if made correctly! I also make a drink made of 6 eggs, whisked then microwaved for 20-30 seconds and mixed with a little whey, water and sweetener. This is just as quick to drink. I still maintain that most people can eat at least every 3 hours with a tablespoon of whey in between to top the amino pool if they really want to. Is it that most people are lazy in this day and age, not taking the time to prepare their meals the night before and put them in tupperware's LOL? If the newbies here could get 150g from whole food ( which isnt hard IMO ), then 50g PWO from whey or the like, then they are eating pretty much what they need!! If they then want extra Kcals from a conveinient source, then drink some maltodextrine with squash for taste. Whey IMO is still overpriced because even though gram for gram, its cheaper than food, it still doesnt bennefit us in growth as well as food. If it doesnt make us grow as well as food then we are wasting our money! If it doesnt make us grow as well as food, and we still use it, then we are cheating ourselves! I can understand it when a 22stone lump (and I know a few who do this) is eating 2 turkey breasts with 100g rice and 2 cans of tuna mixed in every 3 hours. These guys need to use whey etc cos they cant eat any more! Can the rest of us really say that we cant physically eat more, or again is it stubborn or laziness. I am in no way saying that everyone is lazy, or arnt serious about nutrition, instead I'm asking people to really think if they can push themselves that little bit more, to get the most from real food because at the end of the day, its them that benefits. Ok rant over, my last comment is that suups are supps, thats why they are called supps!! Still following me?..Good. They should never be used to replace a meal which is what I see all the time in diets. If people must use them then IMO whole food every 3 hours with 15-20g of whey sneaked in between may help top up aminos. So one last thought for you all to ponder upon. If you were on a desert island for bodybuilders only, and were offerd 100kg of steak, or 100kg of whey, which would you choose to consume? I know whay I would choose for sure! __________________ *To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.* 'Genetics is the science of heredity and variation in living organisms. Inheritance in organisms occurs by means of discrete traits, called genes.'

04-01-2005, 08:52 PM	#2 (permalink)
robdog Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Home!! Posts: 5,579	Another excellent read mate. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. 25% off for UKM members (discount code UKM25)

05-01-2005, 06:48 PM	#3 (permalink)
Jimmy Super Moderator Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Forest gym crawley Posts: 4,301	cheers rob i know your humoring me as you have read them already!!!! __________________ *To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.* 'Genetics is the science of heredity and variation in living organisms. Inheritance in organisms occurs by means of discrete traits, called genes.'

05-01-2005, 07:04 PM	#4 (permalink)
robdog Super Moderator Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Home!! Posts: 5,579	LOL i have read them all yes mate but still it doesnt hurt to reread them. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. 25% off for UKM members (discount code UKM25)

08-01-2005, 07:43 PM	#6 (permalink)
trickymicky69 Wondering how people have the time to do all this over-complicating Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: sunnyside up Posts: 1,205	deffo gonna try that shake recipe. quality protein shake for the price of six eggs? whats that 60p? cheap as fookin chips jimmy lad __________________ 'those who look but do not see, go away no wiser than whence they came"

05-01-2005, 07:04 PM	#5 (permalink)
jas uk Newbie Trainer Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 87	Only new to this diet lark but when I thought about buying shakes I realised that if I eat something it would feel better than a liquid meal.So I think when cutting food will fill you up ,and when bulking meat ,eggs or whatever will contian more cals than a shake in water +its easier to add carbs and fats to a meal.

08-01-2005, 07:47 PM	#7 (permalink)
Thor Guest Posts: n/a	food is the main supplement any bodybuilder/powerlifter/strongman needs i keep the whey for if i aint got time to eat, of for post work, apart from that u cant beat good old FOOD