miami797

Article 1:
Injectable testosterone undecanoate has more favourable pharmacokinetics and pharmacodynamics than testosterone enanthate CJ Partsch, GF Weinbauer, R Fang, and E Nieschlag
Institute of Reproductive Medicine of the University, Munster, Germany.



Testosterone preparations producing constant physiological testosterone serum levels are desirable for long-term treatment of androgen deficiency. However, all injectable testosterone esters used clinically for substitution of male hypogonadism are characterized by unfavourable pharmacokinetics. We therefore tested two groups of five long-term orchidectomized cynomolgus monkeys (Macaca fascicularis), which received a single intramuscular injection of 10 mg/kg body weight of an injectable testosterone undecanoate (TU) preparation or testosterone enanthate (TE) in a preclinical study to assess the pharmacokinetic and pharmacodynamic characteristics of TU in comparison to TE. The dose was equivalent to 6.3 and 7.2 mg of pure testosterone per kilogram body weight in the TU and TE group, respectively. Following injection of TU, mean serum testosterone rose to 58 +/- 18 nmol/l on day 1 and remained at moderately supraphysiological levels of 40-68 nmol/l for 45 days. Thereafter, testosterone levels were maintained in the normal range of intact monkeys for another 56 days. The TE injection resulted in highly supraphysiological levels of 100-177 nmol/l from immediately after the injection to day 5. A rapid decline followed and testosterone levels reached the lower limit of normal after 31 days. Serum testosterone levels were significantly higher in the TE-than in the TU-treated animals on days 0.5-7 (p < 0.05). Significantly lower testosterone levels were seen in the TE than in the TU group on days 16, 22, 25 and 31 (p < 0.05).(ABSTRACT TRUNCATED AT 250 WORDS)


Article 2:
Repeated intramuscular injections of testosterone undecanoate for substitution therapy in hypogonadal men
Eberhard Nieschlag, Dorothee Büchter, Sigrid von Eckardstein, Katrin Abshagen, Manuela Simoni & Hermann M. Behre0Institute of Reproductive Medicine of the University, Münster, Germany
Correspondence to: Prof. Dr E. Nieschlag, Institute of Reproductive Medicine of the University, Domagkstr.11, D–48149 Münster, Germany. Fax: + 49 251835 6093; E-mail: nieschl@uni-muenster.de

OBJECTIVE
To investigate the suitability of intramuscular testosterone undecanoate (TU) injections for substitution therapy in hypogonadal men.

STUDY DESIGN
Clinical, open-label, non-randomized trial of 13 hypogonadal men receiving 4 intramuscular injections of 1000 mg TU in 4-ml castor oil at 6-week intervals. General wellbeing, sexual parameters, clinical chemistry, hormone levels, prostate size and prostate-specific antigen (PSA) were evaluated over 24 weeks and compared with baseline values.

RESULTS
Testosterone serum levels were never found below the lower limit of normal and only briefly after the 3rd and 4th injection above the upper limit of normal, while peak and trough values increased over the 24-week observation period. Oestradiol and dihydrotestosterone followed this pattern, not exceeding the normal limits. No serious side-effects were noted. Slight increases in body weight, haemoglobin, haematocrit, prostate volume and PSA, suppression of gonadotrophins as well as increased ejaculation frequency occurred as signs of adequate testosterone substitution.

CONCLUSION
Testosterone undecanoate is well tolerated by the patients. The injection intervals can be extended even beyond the 6-week periods chosen in the present study. Altogether, intramuscular testosterone undecanoate appears to be well suited for long-term substitution therapy in hypogonadism and hormonal male contraception

Links to these articles:
1. http://www.eje-online.org/cgi/conten...ract/132/4/514
2. http://www.blackwell-synergy.com/lin...5.1999.00881.x

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hackskii

I saw swale answer to this one.
He suggested it was too hard to dose a man with a super long ester.
But then again he is a TRT doc.

This is one reason why I suggest guys wait 3 week after last shot of sust.
But looking at this maybe 4 weeks might be better for recovery.

But if you hate jabs then this is very cool and you could shoot every couple or even few weeks depending on dose.

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Scott


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Nytol

You will have to up the dose though, as you get less test per gram, as the Undec ester is bigger that the enanthate ester.

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hackskii

It weights more due to the ester coorect?
So you get less mg per ml correct?

But not having to jab for awhile to me sounds great, but the clearance time to start PCT would be terribly hard to calculate.
Damn near would have to go on blood work

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Scott


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miami797

Ester weight. Same reason for the enanthare-cypionate debate (well, one of the reasons).

Although, it's such a small difference I doubt you would even know it.

Would've like to see the doc's response to this.

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Nytol

Yes that is correct.

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Nytol

It is a much bigger difference than the enth/cyp compounds

Enth is about 30% ester weight, where as Undec is nearly 40%.

Over the course of a 10 week cycle, at 1g per week, that adds up to be a fair difference in the amount of test actually available to the body.

Certainly something to take into account.

Where as cyp/enth is only 1% difference in ester weight.

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miami797

Molecular weight of these two. Not saying your're wrong Nytol, just adding to it with some numbers.

Testosterone Base: 288.4
Testosterone Enanthate: 400.6
Testosterone Undecanoate: 456.7
Testosterone Cypionate: 412.6

Also, undecanoate has 11 carbons and 22 hydrogens. I'm sure most of you already know that enanthate has C7 H14.

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Nytol

Milligrams below are the estimated amount of active hormone per 100mg of hormone and ester

Testosterone Base: 100mg
Testosterone Acetate: 83mg
Testosterone Propionate: 80mg
Testosterone Isocaproate: 72mg
Testosterone Enanthate: 70mg
Testosterone Cypionate: 69mg
Testosterone Phenylpropionate: 66mg
Testosterone Decanoate: 62mg
Testosterone Undecanoate: 61mg

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hackskii

Ouch, so what would sust be in total mg for test then?
Under 200mg?

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Scott


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miami797

Sustanon250 (30mg prop, 60mg phenyl prop, 60mg iso, 100mg deca) would wind up coming out with about 169.2mg of actual test. If you go according to these numbers you come out with this
prop @ 24mg
phen @ 40mg
iso @ 43.2
deca @ 62mg

correct me if I'm wrong, but this is what I'm coming up with.

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hackskii

My math sucks, I would not even guess but I bet that is pretty freaking close.

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Scott


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Nytol

Yeah that is about right, make you think a bit more about what drug ester to use, e.g phenylprop is ****, as it is pretty much the same as prop but a lot bigger, so less test.

Unfortunately we have to put up with it in NPP, as there is no Nandrolone Prop, but there is Nandrolone base, and I shall be aquiring some soon,

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tkd

The leaflet inside my testoviron depot says :

1ml / 250mg testosterone enanthate contains the equivalent of 180mg of testosterone.

Nytol

That is about right then, 175/180mg

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