Robbyg

So if you were using 500ius twice aweek through out the cycle would this still be ok and aid recovery still ? thanks Scott

brownie

good question,.. this is exactly what i was thinking... do you stiil do this and then follow he's protocol

taslajrisi

[quote=hackskii;173022]I talked to the doc today on the phone and he answered many questions for me in regards to recovery of the HPTA.
For those of you who don’t know what that is it is “Hypothalamus Pituitary Testicular Axis”
After administration of AAS, you have shutdown of the HPTA. Depending on the meds taken shutdown can be severe and much does depend on the person as well.

This is the protocol the doc said he used in literally thousands of users with suppressed HPTA.
First thing, the 500iu a day was not enough to make the testicles do their job, he suggested this was just a waste of time and money.
He suggests 8 shots of HCG @ 2500iu EOD.
With this you take 20 mg of nolvadex for 45 days.
Clomid is also taken but twice a day @ 50mg each dose 12 hours apart.

The reason for the amounts of HCG (which is the most important part, if the balls don’t fire everything else is worthless), is based on his determination to bring the balls back to life, too little wont accomplish this, too much risks damage to the Leydig cells.
So he basically was saying that you do the HCG and around day 10 of the above protocol, you should get a blood test for testosterone. If it is above 400 or greater then this says the balls will be just fine once you get off the HCG and the Clomid and nolva take over. This will accept the LH that you are putting out to maintain testicular function.
He used the term like jumping a car. Your battery (Pituitary gland) if low wont start your car (your testicles), if you use another car and jumper cables (HCG) once the car starts your battery (HP part of the HPTA) will keep your car running.

The clomid by itself he suggested can inhibit either the pituitary or the hypothalamus (can’t remember which one) but if taken with nolva this blocks the estrogen receptors so you wont inhibit that.
So clomid in his protocol is always taken with nolvadex ALWAYS.

He did mention that sometimes the balls just don’t take and then you do the protocol again. He said it was rare that he could not fire up the HPTA.
He said that beings that I have good size difference (balls), feel good, strength gains, and a greasy face he felt I should have no problems with returning the HPTA.

Some things he said was tribulis was actually inhibitory on the HPTA, great I wish I found that out after I bought two bottles.

ZMA, he said if it made me feel good then go for it but it is placebo and the HCG, clomid, nolva was it and all that is needed.

Talked to him about progesterone and he said never take that if you are a man (the last doc prescribed it to me)

Sorry aftershock, I forgot to ask him about the GH question he was saying so much I was just trying to listen.

One thing he did mention (in an article) was that HGH actually helped with the testicular recovery with things and adding that to the Protocol is a good idea and productive.

Avoid aspirin when on HCG as it kind of ruins the effects.

He said oxandrolone was suppressive on the HPTA, but Deca and Anadrol were probably the worst in his opinion. I asked him about tren but he had no knowledge as he never used it.
He did mention that test in itself was not all that suppressive and he has seen guys on 18 months that came off and made a full recovery in 45 days with the above protocol.

He said one of the best ways was 12 weeks of test, followed by the above protocol, then start another 12 weeks followed by the above protocol with a month off after that then start again.

He did say that desensitization to HCG took around 2 months, and the dose of 2500 was fine and no damage or desensitization would occur if you followed his protocol.

There it is


Trackskii, can you respond to my post two posts back?
Thank you

taslajrisi

Oops I meant Hackskii
:-)

hackskii

Start them all the same day, I would do the clomid and nolva in the morning, then clomid in the afternoon (both 50mg), then before bed, do the HCG.
If that keeps you awake then shoot in the morning, I cant shoot at night but I found this works the best.

Tribestin is poo poo, I waisted much money on that and the only thing I got from it is loss of money.
Save your money.
If you want supps, then take 1000iu vitamin E every day, take ZMA at night before bed empty stomach, this will help you sleep if the HCG is affecting things.
Melatonin is a great addition to aid in sleep too, and possible GH release when sleeping.
Cant tell you if it would aid in recovery, but it is suspect HGH is helpful.
Plus at 41 your melatonin levels will be compromised some anyway.

Just make sure that when you start your PCT that you have not been on for a while and make sure the stuff is cleared.
If you like you can give me a PM and tell me how much and how long you were on.

You should be fine, dont worry, stress wont help you here, you will be fine.

You would not need anywhere near the amounts if you use it during than not.
You can continue using HCG along with an AI during the clearance time of your gear, then yes, you can continue low dose in the beginning of PCT. I did this last time and that recovery went by far the best.
I was shooting 500iu during the cycle twice a week, but I still noticed some testicular atrophy at the end of the cycle.
So, I kept doing the 500iu, then did 1,000iu EOD for like 4 shots, then kept the clomid and nolva as above.
That recovery went super easy, best one yet.

__________________
Power over others is weakness disguised as strength.

Scott

taslajrisi

Thanks so much Scott

I may PM you soon but I need a serious jumpstart as I did not use hcg during cycle. I know i experienced atrophy during cycle but thought it would bounce back with some clom/nolva or trib. Not the case. I have been off now for more than a month so everything is cleared. What do you think of DHEA?

taslajrisi

One last question....
Do you shoot HCG IM or SQ ?
I used to just use slin pin in a delt?

hackskii

Sub-Q on the HCG mate.

DHEA is awesome, it can supply the raw building materials for recovery of T levels, but it is best to aid in controlling cortisol.
But, too much converts to estrogen, so I would be very careful with this one, low dose is ok, something like 25mg max a day, high dose of DHEA can actually cause testicular atrophy.
It can elivate testosterone in women, and estrogen in men............
But for adrenal issues, it does work pretty killer and if you have been on for a long time, no doubt you will have adrenal burnout to some degree.

__________________
Power over others is weakness disguised as strength.

Scott

dan2004

Hi Scott in conjunction with Rhom pct caps how does this look?

Week1-12 500mg Test per week.

week 12-14 2500hcg EOD
week 12-16 Rhom pct caps?

Would this work or does he advise use of pct for 45 days rather than standard 30?. And stupid Question but is that 2500 HCG split throughout the day EOD or in one go lol.

hackskii

What kind of test?
You need some time for that to clear, if you dont recovery wont be possible.
How much test and what type?

Sorry about the Rhom caps, I dont really know what they contain.
I know basicly what is in there but not how much.
100mg a day of clomid works nice.

The HCG is shot at night before bed, about a couple of hours before would be nice.

__________________
Power over others is weakness disguised as strength.

Scott

dan2004

Weeks 1-12 Once Per Week @
Testosterone Heptylate 300mg
Nandralone Deconate 200mg

When would you kick the HCG/PCT in. So 2500 right before bed for 15 days EOD ? So would need 7 days worth at 2500.

I would assume id wait for the HCG 15 days before hitting the PCT Caps then? I think the contain Clomid,Nolvadex,Proviron and 1 other compound not sure how much either tho? How does that sound.

paulo

sticky for this surely??

hackskii

Start PCT day 17 from last jab.
Start the PCT all at once and it is 8 shots of 2500 that is 20,000iu total of HCG.
I really dont know about the rhom caps to be honest.

__________________
Power over others is weakness disguised as strength.

Scott

hackskii

I think there should be just one sticky on PCT, and then posts that support it.
I would have to start over....lol
But it would be worth it.

__________________
Power over others is weakness disguised as strength.

Scott

hackskii

I put everything here: http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/steroid-t...nding-pct.html

__________________
Power over others is weakness disguised as strength.

Scott