tren and prop sides - UK-Muscle Body Building Community

cyclops_45 · 07-10-2005, 11:37 PM

What ancilliaries are a defo whilst running tren?

To avoid any estrogen related sides from the prop, I had originally planned to use proviron (25mg-50mg ED), but changed my mind as I think it was heavy on my hairline last cycle, so may just run nolva.

On a tren and prop cycle has anybody here had "tren gyno"?

I hear that the best way to avoid progesterone sides is dostinex
or bromo along with some B6 at around 400mg ED... but then as someone else agreed doesn't estrogen have to be present for progesterone sides to surface?

-Is the dostinex OR bromo a must?
-I heard the bromo sides are harsh (what are we talking about here?)
-where do you get vit B6 from - your source or the health store (okay at this point you can laugh)

Can someone give me some input.

CYCLE:
weeks 1-6: tren @75mg EOD
weeks 1-7 prop @150mg EOD

**big** · 07-10-2005, 11:49 PM

Nice looking cycle.

Yes, tren gyno is real. I know people (both online and offline) who have suffered from it. Dostinex cured the gyno each time. Have dostinex on-hand. It is a sensible idea. Better safe than sorry.

Yes, you can run b6, this is a good idea. You get it from any health store. I like http://www.zipvit.com personally (assuming you're in the UK).

Run adex during cycle to prevent test gyno, and have plenty of nolva on-hand.

I would do this:
1-6 Tren 75mg EOD
1-7 Prop 150mg EOD
1-7 Adex 0.5mg EOD
1-7 B6 300-400mg ED

Then run nolva and clomid for PCT. Also consider winny at 50mg ED throughout. Also consider running HCG throughout, as this is vital IMO.

I haven't changed the doses of your cycle since you haven't given your stats and cycle history.

cyclops_45 · 08-10-2005, 05:17 PM

thanks for feedback Big; the actual cycle looks like this:

week 1-6 tren ace @ 75mg EOD
week 1-7 test prop @ 75mg ED***
week 5-7 HCG @ 1500iu's x3 shots per week (eg mon, weds, sat)

4 week PCT: starts 3 days after last shot of prop
week 8-12
100mg clomid ED & 20mg nolva ED
(OR I may just run nolva 40mg ED week 8 & 9, 30mg ED week 10, 20mg week 11, etc)

STATS:
age 30, training 4 yrs, 6ft, 225lbs, 15%bf. Both cycles done have been sust (500mg PW) and deca (400-600mg PW) each time got some water & bloat around the nipple area.

*** Im using test prop ED as have got 25mg/ml strength. Im looking at shooting it 2 or 3 times each day.

Q: ive never had to do this, but is it okay to use half an amp (i.e. use 1.5 amps in the morning) then save the half amp in the fridge? (and do the other 1.5 amps in the evening). Its hard to find time to shoot it three times a day for 7 weeks.

OR if its a sterility thing (open amps hanging around can't be good) can I stick 2 amps in in the morning then 1 in the evening ??

**big** · 08-10-2005, 05:35 PM

Run your HCG right through at a lower dose (250-500iu each time). This is far superior to just using it before PCT in my opinion (and the opinions of people like Dr. Swale and Jenetic who are the gurus of PCT). Run it right from week 1, you will be glad you did, trust me.

Just run your 3ml of prop all in 1 shot. Don't bother messing around with shooting 3 times a day... you'll just end up like a pin cushion and will get pretty sick of it quickly. When it comes to the days with shooting the tren too, put all 4ml in the syringe and jab 2ml in one site and 2ml in another site (after changing needles).

In my opinion though, since you've run around 1g/week for each of your last cycles, you might want to add an oral, such as winny or dbol to this cycle.

cyclops_45 · 08-10-2005, 10:58 PM

thanks again for the info Big.

About the HCG: I think your right (I remember reading some of dr swales PCT info on a US board sometime ago).

If I'm shooting 250-500 I.U.'s each shot do you think x3 shots a week is about right for this cycle?

AND do you carry on with these x3 shots per week of HCG for the first week of PCT while nolva therapy begins OR stop the HCG when the last shot of gear is taken?

ALSO how long can I safely store a pre-mixed HCG solution in the fridge for?

**big** · 09-10-2005, 11:36 AM

Yes, 2-3x/week is about right. Up it if your balls start to shrink. Increase the frequency of shots rather than the dose though.

Stop the HCG BEFORE pct.

If the HCG is mixed with the sterile water that it typically comes with it, it will last a couple of days or so. But if you mix it with some bac water, it will last for weeks.

Stu · 09-10-2005, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by big

Yes, 2-3x/week is about right. Up it if your balls start to shrink. Increase the frequency of shots rather than the dose though.

Stop the HCG BEFORE pct.

If the HCG is mixed with the sterile water that it typically comes with it, it will last a couple of days or so. But if you mix it with some bac water, it will last for weeks.

:withstupi

what he said and make sure you use an AI with the hCG if your not already

cyclops_45 · 10-10-2005, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stu

:withstupi

what he said and make sure you use an AI with the hCG if your not already

Stu,

if running HCG throughout cycle are we talking proviron or adex here? (let me know why nolva won't do the trick)

I've been getting shafted when it comes to picking up ancilliaries. I got stacks of proviron as I made a bulk purchase with a mate, so got enough to last years. Only trouble is it doesn't like my hair ..........doh!

I take it adex isn't gonna cause the same bad hair days as its not a DHT derivitive? .....let me know if I'm wrong.

One other thing I can get UG adex for a good price from a source I have across the water, but I'm not too sure how well this UG ground med will work. Is it as good as the pharma grad stuff?

Thanks for the info I didn't know this and would have thought that running nolva at the same time as the HCG would do the trick! :confused:

07-10-2005, 11:37 PM	#1 (permalink)
cyclops_45 Apprentice Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 85	tren and prop sides What ancilliaries are a defo whilst running tren? To avoid any estrogen related sides from the prop, I had originally planned to use proviron (25mg-50mg ED), but changed my mind as I think it was heavy on my hairline last cycle, so may just run nolva. On a tren and prop cycle has anybody here had "tren gyno"? I hear that the best way to avoid progesterone sides is dostinex or bromo along with some B6 at around 400mg ED... but then as someone else agreed doesn't estrogen have to be present for progesterone sides to surface? -Is the dostinex OR bromo a must? -I heard the bromo sides are harsh (what are we talking about here?) -where do you get vit B6 from - your source or the health store (okay at this point you can laugh) Can someone give me some input. CYCLE: weeks 1-6: tren @75mg EOD weeks 1-7 prop @150mg EOD

07-10-2005, 11:49 PM	#2 (permalink)
big UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: The only side effect of steroids is GREATNESS Posts: 5,406	Nice looking cycle. Yes, tren gyno is real. I know people (both online and offline) who have suffered from it. Dostinex cured the gyno each time. Have dostinex on-hand. It is a sensible idea. Better safe than sorry. Yes, you can run b6, this is a good idea. You get it from any health store. I like http://www.zipvit.com personally (assuming you're in the UK). Run adex during cycle to prevent test gyno, and have plenty of nolva on-hand. I would do this: 1-6 Tren 75mg EOD 1-7 Prop 150mg EOD 1-7 Adex 0.5mg EOD 1-7 B6 300-400mg ED Then run nolva and clomid for PCT. Also consider winny at 50mg ED throughout. Also consider running HCG throughout, as this is vital IMO. I haven't changed the doses of your cycle since you haven't given your stats and cycle history. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

08-10-2005, 05:17 PM	#3 (permalink)
cyclops_45 Apprentice Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 85	thanks for feedback Big; the actual cycle looks like this: week 1-6 tren ace @ 75mg EOD week 1-7 test prop @ 75mg ED* week 5-7 HCG @ 1500iu's x3 shots per week (eg mon, weds, sat) 4 week PCT: starts 3 days after last shot of prop week 8-12 100mg clomid ED & 20mg nolva ED (OR I may just run nolva 40mg ED week 8 & 9, 30mg ED week 10, 20mg week 11, etc) STATS: age 30, training 4 yrs, 6ft, 225lbs, 15%bf. Both cycles done have been sust (500mg PW) and deca (400-600mg PW) each time got some water & bloat around the nipple area. * Im using test prop ED as have got 25mg/ml strength. Im looking at shooting it 2 or 3 times each day. Q: ive never had to do this, but is it okay to use half an amp (i.e. use 1.5 amps in the morning) then save the half amp in the fridge? (and do the other 1.5 amps in the evening). Its hard to find time to shoot it three times a day for 7 weeks. OR if its a sterility thing (open amps hanging around can't be good) can I stick 2 amps in in the morning then 1 in the evening ?? Last edited by cyclops_45; 08-10-2005 at 05:30 PM.

08-10-2005, 05:35 PM	#4 (permalink)
big UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: The only side effect of steroids is GREATNESS Posts: 5,406	Run your HCG right through at a lower dose (250-500iu each time). This is far superior to just using it before PCT in my opinion (and the opinions of people like Dr. Swale and Jenetic who are the gurus of PCT). Run it right from week 1, you will be glad you did, trust me. Just run your 3ml of prop all in 1 shot. Don't bother messing around with shooting 3 times a day... you'll just end up like a pin cushion and will get pretty sick of it quickly. When it comes to the days with shooting the tren too, put all 4ml in the syringe and jab 2ml in one site and 2ml in another site (after changing needles). In my opinion though, since you've run around 1g/week for each of your last cycles, you might want to add an oral, such as winny or dbol to this cycle. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

09-10-2005, 11:36 AM	#6 (permalink)
big UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: The only side effect of steroids is GREATNESS Posts: 5,406	Yes, 2-3x/week is about right. Up it if your balls start to shrink. Increase the frequency of shots rather than the dose though. Stop the HCG BEFORE pct. If the HCG is mixed with the sterile water that it typically comes with it, it will last a couple of days or so. But if you mix it with some bac water, it will last for weeks. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

08-10-2005, 10:58 PM	#5 (permalink)
cyclops_45 Apprentice Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 85	thanks again for the info Big. About the HCG: I think your right (I remember reading some of dr swales PCT info on a US board sometime ago). If I'm shooting 250-500 I.U.'s each shot do you think x3 shots a week is about right for this cycle? AND do you carry on with these x3 shots per week of HCG for the first week of PCT while nolva therapy begins OR stop the HCG when the last shot of gear is taken? ALSO how long can I safely store a pre-mixed HCG solution in the fridge for?

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