Cutting abdominal fat - UK-Muscle Body Building Community

JDN21 · 25-01-2006, 07:25 PM

I am in a quandry.

Since 2001, I have lost 3 stone, established a much leaner body and have built some good muscle in some areas (chest, arms, lats).

I now weigh 10.5stone and am 5'9".

The problem I have is body composition - namely, abdominal fat. I know that it is notoriously difficult to get rid of, but I need to get rid of it because it is the only thing I feel is holding me back.

----

In early Sept 2005, I started a specific high protein diet and a moderate daily calorie defecit of 500kcal. I had a 10k race coming up, so kept to it upto the race (a month later), but fond it made me feel so good that I kept it up 'til Christmas. Just before Christmas, I was 10st exactly. The regime included alot of long distance running at a high intensity and some weights. I looked defined, and I really dont think I lost any muscle - thanks to the protein.

The problem was, I still had stubborn abdominal fat, and although I was looking lean and healthy everywhere else, the handles would not shift. I was worried that continuing my diet would make me lighter still, but not get rid of the problem area.

----

So, I am trying to choose between the following 2 regimes:

*Focus on packing on muscle, with a weight regime and eating more.

0r

*Alter my existing regime to include less intense cardio (more fat-burning jogging rather than time-chasing running) and more weights.

Please advise, bearing in mind that I would prefer the second option, because I would hate to start putting fat on, which I see as inevitable while in a muscle gain cycle.

Thanks, and sorry for the length of the post.

**big** · 25-01-2006, 08:17 PM

What's your current diet dude?

If you want to manipulate your bodyweight/bodyfat, diet is the first thing you need to look at.

JDN21 · 25-01-2006, 09:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by big

What's your current diet dude?

If you want to manipulate your bodyweight/bodyfat, diet is the first thing you need to look at.

Current diet with approximate times:

BREAKFAST (8am)
----

Fibre Bran
Coffee
Protein Shake made with water
Fresh OJ

LUNCH (12noon)
----

4 Scrambled egg whites, 1 yolk
Wholemeal toast
Low fat yogurt

MID-AFTERNOON (3pm)
----

Piece of fruit
Turkey slices (Bernard Matthews style) - would rather actually eat something at this time rather than have another shake.

DINNER (7pm)
----
Normally chicken/fish/steak and veg or salad

EVENING (10pm)
----

Protein Shake made with skimmed milk

----

A post workout/run/football snack normally consists of a banana and a protein shake

**hackskii** · 25-01-2006, 10:06 PM

not too bad on the diet but some people including myself have problem with belly fat.
For the most part this is a insulin problem.

How do you control insulin?
Fiber, fat and protein slow down carbohydrates digestion which in turn slows down the spiking of blood sugar which in turn slows down the spiking of insulin.

One problem I see is not enough fat in your diet.
Dont drop the yolks from the eggs.
If you are going to drop anything, drop sugar, pasta, bread, these will spike blood sugars but when taken with a fiber and fat slows down aborption, and keeps it from spiking insulin.

Insulin is a transport hormone.
It transports nuroushment into the muscle but also can store fat as well.

Id drop the orange juice meal one, switch from bran to oatmeal and add the protein to the oats after they are cooked.
This meal you can add butter. Before we get any further butter is a great food and will not make you fat or raise cholesterol either. I have many articles on them and will post apon request.

Lunch time has too many carbs and not enough fats in it.
Eat the eggs with all the yolks. Again before we go any farther I have articles on this too that suggests eggs will not raise cholesterol and is the most nutritious part of the egg.
Keep the yolks here.
Leave that toast as just one piece and the yogurt, dont choose low fat or dont use flavored stuff either.

Mid afternoon, add a good fat here like fish oils and take 3 with this meal.

Dinner looks good, if it is salad then virgin olive oil and you can use apple cider vinegar with this, both promote good health and the vinegar detoxifies the body and is good for weight loss too, among other things.

last meal, skimmed milk is not as good for you as regular milk and milk fat slows down absorption.

I suspect your low fat diet might be the problem here.
Good fats burn brown fat and also controls insulin, well all fat will do this.
Low fat diets also can render the dieter with low hormones as all sex hormones are made from cholesterol.

Low fat diets are not healthy.
High fat diets are just fine with out the presence of high carb diets.
High fat, high carb diets are not healthy.

Fruits to consider,
berries, pear, apple, apricot, orange, and nectarine, these are low Glycemic Index fruit carbohydrates.

You can eat vegetables too, they usually are low in the GI, high fiber, high phytonutrients, minreals, vitamins, etc.
Very good choice for any meal.

Have to tell you tho, restance training will burn fat for up to 3 days while cardio will burn for just about 3 hours after you are done.

Also alot of cardio (runners) have low test levels too.
Part of the length of the runs.
Consider sprinting instead, you will work the quads very well and burn fat too.

JDN21 · 25-01-2006, 10:27 PM

Thanks - got a couple of points though, becuase I have to keep this diet as enjoyable as possible to keep me motivated.

Is there another alternative to oatmeal? Everyone here seems to have it, but I cant stand it. Isn't a high fibre breakfast with a protein shake good enough?

When you say 'avoid the flavoured yogurts' - do you mean everything apart from the natural stuff? I get these yogurts that have only 45 kcal per pot, including 4.8grams of protein. They are really tasty, and help to keep you motivated when everything else you eat is so repetitive.

----

As far as the workout goes, I am now commiting to 3 low intensity runs a week. I am obliged to play football 3 times a week - they are high intensity, and includes alot of sprinting. Finally, when I workout with weights, I work to fatigue. I know that with a calorie defecit, I wont gain muscle, but will the nature of the workout, and assumed rise in growth hormone help to change my body composition significantly (i.e. - lose the love handles)?

**hackskii** · 25-01-2006, 10:54 PM

Yes, but overtraining will burn your muscle and cause a loss in that.

Look at it like this.
You can lose about 2-3 lbs of muscle a week providing the % of body fat is over about 20%
It probably takes 30 days to gain 2 lbs of muscle.

A bad diet and overtraining could in theory burn 2 lbs of muscle a week too.
But to get that back, it is hell.
You could burn it 4 times quicker than you can build it.

The idea is targeting fat loss.
The lower precentage of bodyfat you are the easier it is to burn muscle when trying to lets say take 3 lbs of weight a week.
A guy 25% bodyfat can but not 10%
When you get around 15% bodyfat, I would not want to lose more than 1.5 lbs a week and even 1 lb would be better.

Remember it takes 3500 cals to equal just 1 lb.
64 oz of water burns 50 cals
128 oz of ice water burns 150 cals

Belly fat and controlling insulin is where it is at.
Stick to lower GI carbs (except post workout shake), get some good fats like fish oils down you (12) a day.
Add fiber, shoot for 35 grams a day and this in itself will not only clean you out but also burn cals breaking down this non soluable substance and also lower insulins responce if it is in the meal.

Love handles are the last place in fat loss you will lose.
The face is the first, belly last.

25-01-2006, 07:25 PM	#1 (permalink)
JDN21 Newbie Trainer Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 36	Cutting abdominal fat I am in a quandry. Since 2001, I have lost 3 stone, established a much leaner body and have built some good muscle in some areas (chest, arms, lats). I now weigh 10.5stone and am 5'9". The problem I have is body composition - namely, abdominal fat. I know that it is notoriously difficult to get rid of, but I need to get rid of it because it is the only thing I feel is holding me back. ---- In early Sept 2005, I started a specific high protein diet and a moderate daily calorie defecit of 500kcal. I had a 10k race coming up, so kept to it upto the race (a month later), but fond it made me feel so good that I kept it up 'til Christmas. Just before Christmas, I was 10st exactly. The regime included alot of long distance running at a high intensity and some weights. I looked defined, and I really dont think I lost any muscle - thanks to the protein. The problem was, I still had stubborn abdominal fat, and although I was looking lean and healthy everywhere else, the handles would not shift. I was worried that continuing my diet would make me lighter still, but not get rid of the problem area. ---- So, I am trying to choose between the following 2 regimes: Focus on packing on muscle, with a weight regime and eating more. 0r Alter my existing regime to include less intense cardio (more fat-burning jogging rather than time-chasing running) and more weights. Please advise, bearing in mind that I would prefer the second option, because I would hate to start putting fat on, which I see as inevitable while in a muscle gain cycle. Thanks, and sorry for the length of the post.

25-01-2006, 08:17 PM	#2 (permalink)
big UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Sep 2004 Location: The only side effect of steroids is GREATNESS Posts: 5,416	What's your current diet dude? If you want to manipulate your bodyweight/bodyfat, diet is the first thing you need to look at. __________________ To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts. To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

25-01-2006, 10:06 PM	#4 (permalink)
hackskii UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sunny Southern California U.S.A. Posts: 23,689	not too bad on the diet but some people including myself have problem with belly fat. For the most part this is a insulin problem. How do you control insulin? Fiber, fat and protein slow down carbohydrates digestion which in turn slows down the spiking of blood sugar which in turn slows down the spiking of insulin. One problem I see is not enough fat in your diet. Dont drop the yolks from the eggs. If you are going to drop anything, drop sugar, pasta, bread, these will spike blood sugars but when taken with a fiber and fat slows down aborption, and keeps it from spiking insulin. Insulin is a transport hormone. It transports nuroushment into the muscle but also can store fat as well. Id drop the orange juice meal one, switch from bran to oatmeal and add the protein to the oats after they are cooked. This meal you can add butter. Before we get any further butter is a great food and will not make you fat or raise cholesterol either. I have many articles on them and will post apon request. Lunch time has too many carbs and not enough fats in it. Eat the eggs with all the yolks. Again before we go any farther I have articles on this too that suggests eggs will not raise cholesterol and is the most nutritious part of the egg. Keep the yolks here. Leave that toast as just one piece and the yogurt, dont choose low fat or dont use flavored stuff either. Mid afternoon, add a good fat here like fish oils and take 3 with this meal. Dinner looks good, if it is salad then virgin olive oil and you can use apple cider vinegar with this, both promote good health and the vinegar detoxifies the body and is good for weight loss too, among other things. last meal, skimmed milk is not as good for you as regular milk and milk fat slows down absorption. I suspect your low fat diet might be the problem here. Good fats burn brown fat and also controls insulin, well all fat will do this. Low fat diets also can render the dieter with low hormones as all sex hormones are made from cholesterol. Low fat diets are not healthy. High fat diets are just fine with out the presence of high carb diets. High fat, high carb diets are not healthy. Fruits to consider, berries, pear, apple, apricot, orange, and nectarine, these are low Glycemic Index fruit carbohydrates. You can eat vegetables too, they usually are low in the GI, high fiber, high phytonutrients, minreals, vitamins, etc. Very good choice for any meal. Have to tell you tho, restance training will burn fat for up to 3 days while cardio will burn for just about 3 hours after you are done. Also alot of cardio (runners) have low test levels too. Part of the length of the runs. Consider sprinting instead, you will work the quads very well and burn fat too. __________________ "Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away." - George Carlin Scott To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

25-01-2006, 10:54 PM	#6 (permalink)
hackskii UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sunny Southern California U.S.A. Posts: 23,689	Yes, but overtraining will burn your muscle and cause a loss in that. Look at it like this. You can lose about 2-3 lbs of muscle a week providing the % of body fat is over about 20% It probably takes 30 days to gain 2 lbs of muscle. A bad diet and overtraining could in theory burn 2 lbs of muscle a week too. But to get that back, it is hell. You could burn it 4 times quicker than you can build it. The idea is targeting fat loss. The lower precentage of bodyfat you are the easier it is to burn muscle when trying to lets say take 3 lbs of weight a week. A guy 25% bodyfat can but not 10% When you get around 15% bodyfat, I would not want to lose more than 1.5 lbs a week and even 1 lb would be better. Remember it takes 3500 cals to equal just 1 lb. 64 oz of water burns 50 cals 128 oz of ice water burns 150 cals Belly fat and controlling insulin is where it is at. Stick to lower GI carbs (except post workout shake), get some good fats like fish oils down you (12) a day. Add fiber, shoot for 35 grams a day and this in itself will not only clean you out but also burn cals breaking down this non soluable substance and also lower insulins responce if it is in the meal. Love handles are the last place in fat loss you will lose. The face is the first, belly last. __________________ "Life is not measured by the number of breaths we take, but by the moments that take our breath away." - George Carlin Scott To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

25-01-2006, 10:27 PM	#5 (permalink)
JDN21 Newbie Trainer Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 36	Thanks - got a couple of points though, becuase I have to keep this diet as enjoyable as possible to keep me motivated. Is there another alternative to oatmeal? Everyone here seems to have it, but I cant stand it. Isn't a high fibre breakfast with a protein shake good enough? When you say 'avoid the flavoured yogurts' - do you mean everything apart from the natural stuff? I get these yogurts that have only 45 kcal per pot, including 4.8grams of protein. They are really tasty, and help to keep you motivated when everything else you eat is so repetitive. ---- As far as the workout goes, I am now commiting to 3 low intensity runs a week. I am obliged to play football 3 times a week - they are high intensity, and includes alot of sprinting. Finally, when I workout with weights, I work to fatigue. I know that with a calorie defecit, I wont gain muscle, but will the nature of the workout, and assumed rise in growth hormone help to change my body composition significantly (i.e. - lose the love handles)?