Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 46
  1. #16
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    5,775
    Liked
    21 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich-B View Post
    Con, I agree with this mate as I have followed this diet in the past with decent results, I actually lean bulked on it last year, I was on 250mg of Test at the time though.

    Could you answer the following:

    1. By veg with few calories do you mean for example; spinach, green salad, peppers, mushrooms, onions etc?

    2. Can you eat these veg throughout the day or only in the PWO carb intake window?

    3. What would be the caloric breakdown percentages of protein/carbs/fats on the diet you describe above?

    Cheers
    Veg choices would be anything bar things like potato, yams, excessive amounts of carrots most other things would be completely fine at any time.

    Caloric intake for my self as i follow this diet now as i no longer want to gain weight rather get leaner and more muscular.
    Current stats 245lb and decently lean (full abbs visible)
    400 protein
    250 carb (100 after training 100 one hour after training 50 2 hours after that last meal)
    for fats 3 tbs olive oil 2 tbs fish oil, 5 whole eggs, lean grass fed beef so between 120-150 grams on an average day.

  2. #17
    Gym Addict
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Posts
    121
    Liked
    5 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim Reaper View Post
    I think your find your not actually doing keto as you dont do refeed on keto, what your doing is actually ckd or carb cycling. I started what i thought was keto but got put in my place by dutch scott Have been doing ckd for nearly 10 wks now and gonna run till the new year ( But started running t3 + clen cycle this week as things had slowed down ) My only sides have being bunged up and taking loads of meds to sort that out !!!
    Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't a CKD a Keto diet? They are both the exact same thing, people just refer to it either as one of the other. Carb cycling on the other hand is different.

    See here for CKD/Keto information; http://www.bodybuildingdungeon.com/f...enic-diet.html

    There is more about carb cycling/timed carbs in one of the sticky threads in the losing weight section. CKD/Keto is all about keeping carbs to an absolute minimum. Carb cycling you have low/medium/high carb days.

    If your running different diets/cycles then I'd advise that you post up your questions/routine/diet on here as that's what I did and the information that some of these guys have provided is immense and has really helped me out.

    BTW, I'm doing a CKD/Keto diet and eat approximately 160g protein a day, 140g fats and 10-20g of carbs. I do this every day and have one refeed a week. I'm personally trying to push the refeed further and further back until I don't need to do it anymore. Doing it this way I lost 3lbs last week, I'm yet to weigh myself this week though so I'll keep my thread updated with that.

    Hope this has been of some help though.

  3. #18
    Massive improvements made, cant wait to compete again
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    London
    Posts
    7,181
    Liked
    416 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by dutch_scott View Post
    ps. its all carb cycling here,
    grr i go red, u cant have keytones in high ammounts in blood if ur ingesting sugars or low or hi gi carbs even after training, its carb cycling. keto-= keytones. in defecit of available carbs. oxymoron if ur eating them to expect to produce keytones..

    LOL VERY TRUE i have seen loads of people posting 'im doing keto' 'my keto diet plan' etc etc only to read and see 'oats post workout' 'banana postworkout'

    FFS people KETO = NO CARBS AT ALL (only incidental ones which will come from your nuts and vege)

  4. #19
    Massive improvements made, cant wait to compete again
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    London
    Posts
    7,181
    Liked
    416 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    oh yea forgot to mention REFEEDS ARE NOT REQUIRED EVERY WEEK if you HAVE TO HAVE ONE, then it should only be prob once every 10-14 days. and one or 2 meals not 2 friggen days gggrrrrrr but there is no point really other than people not being able to handle the diet. If your in keto why put your body through going in and out of it, everyone who has done it knows they feel **** for the first few days going into keto why go through that every week

  5. #20
    Getting bored sh1tless....
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    In a house
    Posts
    5,042
    Liked
    64 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Dutch,

    Are you planning to follow a similar keto diet that you recently did for your assault on the UKBFF scene in 2011?
    You gain strength, courage, and confidence by every experience in which you really stop to look fear in the face. You must do the things which you think you cannot do.

    -Eleanor Roosevelt-

  6. #21
    Rising from the ashes
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    8,220
    Liked
    1011 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by dutch_scott View Post
    plus please also note how long it takes to deplete the liver from these refeed days, based on this

    bbuilderrs already lean ie furnace burning take 3-5days to deplete when they r trying, so why do guys refeed wen they cant possibly then slip into keto for, its avg 4-5 days, oh look 3 days in keto beforee they fill out again.

    simply u can lose fat by dropping carbs but my issue is keto the word the term the diet, is WITHOUT carbs. none, exactly as miss bc says.
    iv done tests in uni in lab with bg monitors, keto stix(the real ones) and glyco strips and those refeeds TOTALLY halt keto for days.


    Spot on. I noticed this - if I wasn't going clean through a weekend - so 2 weeks between refeeds - it didn't work nearly as effective because most of that first week is re-depletion. As you say about carb ingestion, you also wont get into keto if you have an appreciable amount of glycogen sitting stored.

    Targeted keto, with carbs around the workout, just lacks sense and logic to me on so many levels, even the name - like you say, you won't be in true ketosis, it is simply lower calorie with timed carbs - might still work... but keto it is not.
    Last edited by rs007; 28-10-2010 at 08:45 PM.
    every prick and his dog has to have a "protocol" these days - but hey, makes it sound like we know what we are doing, right?" me, 2011

    Read my sh1t journal! Or just come and take the pi$$!!! Drugs, women, booze and occasional gayness!

  7. #22
    Rising from the ashes
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    8,220
    Liked
    1011 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by MissBC View Post
    oh yea forgot to mention REFEEDS ARE NOT REQUIRED EVERY WEEK if you HAVE TO HAVE ONE, then it should only be prob once every 10-14 days. and one or 2 meals not 2 friggen days gggrrrrrr but there is no point really other than people not being able to handle the diet. If your in keto why put your body through going in and out of it, everyone who has done it knows they feel **** for the first few days going into keto why go through that every week
    I am a notorious refeeder, 2ish days plus sometimes - and even I curbed it on keto to an evening - hard - but stop-starting the keto process was harder on mind and body... once in it, stay in it. More muscle preservation that way too.
    every prick and his dog has to have a "protocol" these days - but hey, makes it sound like we know what we are doing, right?" me, 2011

    Read my sh1t journal! Or just come and take the pi$$!!! Drugs, women, booze and occasional gayness!

  8. #23
    Massive improvements made, cant wait to compete again
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    London
    Posts
    7,181
    Liked
    416 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    whats the point eating carbs fats are so much better, if you want to eat something naughty have some bacon or cheese aslong as it fits into your cals. why risk going in and out and in and out of keto all he friggen time, things take time to work and it will take a week or 2 for your body to get into full swing with keto.

    at the mo i eat, turkey rashers, eggs, nuts, protein, chicken, little bit of mozorella cheese on my salad and vege.. nothing else (oh maybe some lean mince on occasion)

  9. #24
    LIFT!!
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    2,203
    Liked
    181 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    I always thought the weekly refeeds were necessary to kick start the metabolism after a week of it slowing down with no carbs??

    I could easily go 2 weeks without carbs if not more.

  10. #25
    DB
    DB is offline
    UK-Muscle Moderator
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    SW London
    Posts
    15,394
    Liked
    883 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Agree with Scott, many people want to be a park of the keto club but weeks on end without cheats they just can't handle!

  11. #26
    Getting bored sh1tless....
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    In a house
    Posts
    5,042
    Liked
    64 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    I know there should be literally no carbs on a keto diet, but whey shakes like 90+ etc have 3.5g per serving - would that slow the process down if having 2-3 shakes a day with ONLY those carbs in??
    You gain strength, courage, and confidence by every experience in which you really stop to look fear in the face. You must do the things which you think you cannot do.

    -Eleanor Roosevelt-

  12. #27
    Looking Freaky
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    High Wycombe
    Posts
    517
    Liked
    45 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by rs007 View Post
    I am a notorious refeeder, 2ish days plus sometimes - and even I curbed it on keto to an evening - hard - but stop-starting the keto process was harder on mind and body... once in it, stay in it. More muscle preservation that way too.
    Agreed, i was re-feeding once a week (CKD) and only because i made a pig of myself at the all-inclusive buffet on a recent holiday i decided to forgo the weekly re-feed.I expected to flatten out in the second week but i've stayed energized and full without a re-feed for 15 days now.
    The re-feed isn't necessary.Also i only noticed the metallic tasting breath (an indication of ketosis...i think) after 9 days of avoiding carbs.So i'm guessing it took me over a week before ketosis was achieved!

  13. #28
    Rising from the ashes
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    8,220
    Liked
    1011 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by chrisj22 View Post
    I know there should be literally no carbs on a keto diet, but whey shakes like 90+ etc have 3.5g per serving - would that slow the process down if having 2-3 shakes a day with ONLY those carbs in??
    You can't get literally nothing in realistic terms, but under a certain level, your body will suck that carb intake up to make glucose up for brain function, and get the rest form dietary protein if need be - so ketosis will still be running rampant to fuel your muscles.

    Common figures is under 50g of carbs per day (and that isnt a case of BOOM I ma allowed 50g so I'll have this candy bar then nowt - evenly spaced to reduce impact) will get you in there intially, later you might need to drop this to sub 30 to keep in there, as your body adapts.

    I found it really easy to keep it as low as 20, that was counting everything, incidental carbs in shakes etc.
    every prick and his dog has to have a "protocol" these days - but hey, makes it sound like we know what we are doing, right?" me, 2011

    Read my sh1t journal! Or just come and take the pi$$!!! Drugs, women, booze and occasional gayness!

  14. #29
    Getting bored sh1tless....
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    In a house
    Posts
    5,042
    Liked
    64 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Quote Originally Posted by rs007 View Post
    You can't get literally nothing in realistic terms, but under a certain level, your body will suck that carb intake up to make glucose up for brain function, and get the rest form dietary protein if need be - so ketosis will still be running rampant to fuel your muscles.

    Common figures is under 50g of carbs per day (and that isnt a case of BOOM I ma allowed 50g so I'll have this candy bar then nowt - evenly spaced to reduce impact) will get you in there intially, later you might need to drop this to sub 30 to keep in there, as your body adapts.

    I found it really easy to keep it as low as 20, that was counting everything, incidental carbs in shakes etc.
    Thanks mate.

    Makes sense
    You gain strength, courage, and confidence by every experience in which you really stop to look fear in the face. You must do the things which you think you cannot do.

    -Eleanor Roosevelt-

  15. #30
    Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    5,775
    Liked
    21 times

    Re: Long term keto dangers?

    Loving the comment from Scott about the amount of time needed to actually need a refeed. I was working with one guy for a show he was doing this summer and this guy thought he needed massive carb ups every 5 days or so. Eventually i grew tired of argueing with him and about a week later he had to pull out from doing the show. (funny thing is this guy is actually a guy who has won open weight classes at shows in my area) Some people never learn.

 

 
Page 2 of 4 FirstFirst 1234 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Long Term Steroid Use
    By Craig660 in forum Steroid and Testosterone information
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 14-04-2010, 11:07 AM
  2. All You Ever Wanted To Know About Long R3 IGF-1!
    By Bazooka Tooth in forum Steroids & Associated Drugs Articles
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 30-12-2009, 02:25 PM
  3. Long Term Post Cycle Experiences
    By SD in forum Steroid and Testosterone information
    Replies: 21
    Last Post: 26-12-2008, 09:33 PM
  4. Terms/Jargen
    By hackskii in forum Steroids & Associated Drugs Articles
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 25-07-2005, 08:49 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.2
Copyright © 2014 vBulletin Solutions, Inc. All rights reserved.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO © 2011, Crawlability, Inc.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
All information contained within this site is for educational purposes only.
We do not endorse the Buying or selling of illegal substances nor do we promote the use of them.

UK-Muscle.co.uk takes no responsibility for any advertisers, thier content or products sold. All products sold by ANY advertisers are seen to be 'Research Items' only and not intended for Human Use.
All times are GMT +1. The time now is 08:13 PM.