Squeeeze

Evening gents,

Looking for an experienced opinion on this conundrum please.

I recently read Mick Harts laymans guide and was planning on starting his suggested 3-day full body workout which is as follows:

Press behind neck 3 x10
Squats 3 x12
flat bench press 3x10
Lat pulldowns 3x12
Close grip bench 3x10
Barbell curls 3x10
Bench dips 3x12

Plus some abs work.

He suggests that this workout is fine for newbies whether natural or assisted. What he doesn't say is if its all 3 sets to failure.

Now this bloke is (apparently) supposed to know what he's talking about but having read Bigs post on How to Grow http://www.uk-muscle.co.uk/general-a...-how-grow.html the above workout starts to look like it could be leaning towards overtraining. Hardly surprising that us newbies get a little confused.

Does the M Hart workout look ok as long as diet and rest are right or should I follow Big's advice, what do you think?

As always your opinion / expertise is appreciated.

thestudbeast

It will work but stop just short of failure, bigs stuff will work too.......... more than one way to skin a cat.

Squeeeze

Thanks studbeast.
Always helps to have someone more experienced confirm/correct things before diving in.

big

With regards to Hart's workout - it will probably work great for many people, as long as the intensity is weighted correctly. Trying to do 3 high volume (12 rep) sets of squats to failure, 3 times a week, is a sure-fire way to overtrain and burn out fast for most people. But keep far enough away from failure, and you'll probably find it works well for you. There are lots of compounds in that routine, and they're done regularly - but you'll have to keep the intensity low(ish) unless you're genetically exceptionally gifted (which, no offense, most people aren't if they need to ask for advice).

Whatever routine you do, make sure you pick weights that you can COMFORTABLY do the set/rep range with, and add a SMALL amount of weight each week. When you hit failure, or miss your set/rep range, that's when you need to change something up. This is the fundamental thing that most people miss - and the reason why most people fail to do well regardless of the reps/sets they choose.

Good luck, and let us know how you get on

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Squeeeze

Thanks for taking the time to share the wisdom Big.

I'll be using the workout with your adivice in mind, so will come back to this in a couple of months to post on how it's going.

Thanks again.

thestudbeast

Use anyone workout for 11 weeks, take a week off then switch to another good workout routine. This way you'll make good gains and also see what type of training suits you best.

hackskii

Ah, a nice refreshing post with good ol common sense.
Nice work big.

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irwit

squats 3 times a week, sounds brutal !

Lea

There is a similar workout on Micks blog page. I tried it for 8 weeks and it is brutal but I have to admit I did grow like a weed.

I was doing Monday, Weds and Friday

Standing flye 3 X 10
Bench 3 X 10
Incline Flyes 3X 10
Squats 3 X 10
Bent Row 3 X 10
Bar Curl 3 X 10
French Press 3 X 10

Abs...

I added 30 mins of cardio on the rest days


It is really hard. I started doing 2 sets until my body got used to it then went to 3. After 8 weeks I needed a rest but the gains were quite good. Be prepared to be completely knackered though

Lost Soul

IMO you would have had a more 'complete' physique with a different plan BUT there are many factors to growth inclusing, diet, rest, genetics, lifestyle and supplementation

The plan alone would not give maximum results in comparison to others

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Lea

the full body routine is good for building a base to build on I got stronger (maybe due to muscle memory???) and used it after a long lay off.

There may be better but there are certainly worse things that you can do.

Dont rely on it for too long though.

Wouldnt you agree lost soul?

wogihao

Where I think people go wrong and go nowhere, is theres a point where you should have the tools in place that you can create your own routines for yourself. You shouldnt be relying on cookie cutter programs. Peoples strenghts/weaknesses vary so why rely on someone who dosent know you from adam to prescribe on of the most important parts of your training - the training program itself.

Use the principles contained in the workout plans to create somthing that meets your needs and objectives and your get a far beter program.

Ofcourse advice and anothr set of eyes is a advantage but untimatly you yourself should be incharge of your own training.

Would you spend hours reading magazine articles, asking for advice on how many hours to sleep, what postion to sleep in, PJ's or boxers? no you make these decisions yourself. why not do the same for training?

willsey4

I've never been a fan of all body workouts. However that doesnt mean they do not work. From day one I had a 3 day a week training split, then when I advanced I went to 4 day and now on to 5 days.

If I was a beginner again I would try this for say 8 weeks to get your body use to the weights and the movement etc. Then after hopefully making some gains move onto a 3 or 4 day a week split.

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want2getstrong

agree, 3 day split for me as a powerlifter worked well for me, squat bench deadlift heavy every week, and on another day the muscles get hit again with other eexercises eg power cleans (hits legs and backs) and do assistance work barbell rows back work on another day, so legs back get hit twice a week

Lost Soul

either or, plenty of pros and cons for splits Vs FBR, the importnat thing though is:

exercise choice
exercise order
reps and sets

which renders the plan below useless

9 sets on chest
3 on back
no hip dominant work and no hamstring work beyond squats
no shoulder work
isolation or bi and tri
no deadlifts or posterior chain work
no vertical plane back work

I would find it hard to suggest the above was written by a professional as a standalone training plan. Its similar to a reps level 2 fcuk up of a fitness instructor

Why not?

If a plan makes progress, why stop?
Overoad dictates growth

if you are adding poundage to:

bench
dead
squats
chins
military press
SLDL
weighted dips

why change things?

dont need to

Nope, as highlighted above.

Whilst i appreciate Mick Hart has a place in bodybuilding folklore taking his advice on training (if the above is a standalone training plan) is like taking your nutritional advice from the back of a frosties packet

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