CNS recovery - UK-Muscle Body Building Community

irwit · 17-03-2008, 01:08 PM

Hi all,

Im not sure if this is the right place to post a question like this but here goes.

The more Im reading up about training and recovery, how different supplements help recovery etc, the more they all seem to place emphasis on muscle repair. However the more Im reading, the more Im starting to think its more and more about CNS recovery aswell. Im wondering if anyone has some good info on CNS and good recovery methods that help. Also signs for CNS not recovering, basically as much info as possible or point me in the right direction of some good info.

Thanks guys :love:

Wee G · 17-03-2008, 05:11 PM

Almost all overtraining / fatigue is neural.

General symptoms...

Drop in specific or general motor performance / loss of motor coordination
Loss or decrease in specialised skills
Irritability
Change in sleep patterns / depth of sleep
Loss of appetite
Shift in resting heart rate
Shift in bodyweight
Change in mental outlook / depression / self-talk, especially combined with lethargy.
"Nervous ticks" and crutch behaviour becoming more common.
Change in libido (usually downward)
Loss of concentration / focus
Slower response / reaction times to stimuli
Cloudy thinking

Cheers,

G

irwit · 17-03-2008, 05:39 PM

So serious overtraining does lead to serious problems then.

So for example when training your cns takes a hit if you are overtraining or not. So is there anything else apart from adequate rest that can help speed up the cns recovery ?

Im basically weighing up the pros and cons of either a push pull legs or 2 day full body split for my next routine. Am I right in saying your whole cns takes as much of a hit wether you have just finished a full body workout or a push day workout for example.

Wee G · 18-03-2008, 08:48 PM

Closest you will get to a rough approximation of CNS sttress directly from training is total load x some kind of "stress" co-efficient.
For example you could go with reps x load = total load then...

1.0 = warmup, no stress
1.2 working set
1.5 = set to failure
1.7 = set + forced reps
2 = set to negative failure

so a set of 10 with 100kg for a warmup =

1000kg total load x 1.0 = 1000 "stress units".

A set of 8 to failure with 120kg =

960kg total load x 1.5 = 1440 "stress units".

and so on.

The co-efficients are basically arbitrary and determined by how you know you respond to training. For example if you know that you can do 1000kg total load with no failure, but in the same time frame you can only recover from 660kg total load when sets are taking to failure, then a set to failure needs to be "worth" about 1.5 times as much as a "warmup" set.

In order to track like this you need a good training diary and experience, otherwise your co-efficients aren't based on anything and it's pointless.

Regarding ways to enhance CNS recovery there are too many to list but here's a starter (credit to Mel Siff for this)

Passive Physical Means
Classical massage
PNF (Neuromuscular means)
Myofascial trigger point massage
Acupressure/ shiatsu
Hydrotherapy
Stretching techniques
Flotation
Aromatherapy
Therapeutic Touch
Electronic technology
Laser therapy
Passive machines
Vibromassagers
Barotherapy (pressure)
Balneo-therapy (baths)
Reflexology
Aromatherapy

Active Physical Means
PNF (Neuromuscular means)
Self-massage (active/passive)
Stretching
Physical activity
Recreational sport
Manual labour
Dance
Play
Postural realignment
Breathing regimens
Progressive relaxation
Tai Chi
Yoga

Table B: PSYCHOLOGICAL MEANS OF RESTORATION
Psychotherapy
Hypnosis
Autogenic training
Operant conditioning
Visualisation/ Guided imagery
Sensory deprivation/modification
Screaming/shouting Music/sound therapy
Singing/chanting
Meditation
Religion
Biofeedback training
Neurolinguistic programming
Laughter/tears . . . . . . .

Cheers,

G

irwit · 19-03-2008, 01:15 PM

Brilliant reply! Some really good info and ideas to work from in there. cheers mate :o) So CNS recovery is as much mental as physical then. Positive mental attitude helps the whole body in more ways than you might first think I guess.

One point, one of your tips for helping CNS recovery Im not sure I fancy tryin is the Vibromassager ... leave that one for the mrs I think ;o)

thanks again

17-03-2008, 01:08 PM	#1 (permalink)
irwit is realising, diet, traing, rest, supplements, 12 egg breakfasts are nothing without consistency Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: London Posts: 505	CNS recovery Hi all, Im not sure if this is the right place to post a question like this but here goes. The more Im reading up about training and recovery, how different supplements help recovery etc, the more they all seem to place emphasis on muscle repair. However the more Im reading, the more Im starting to think its more and more about CNS recovery aswell. Im wondering if anyone has some good info on CNS and good recovery methods that help. Also signs for CNS not recovering, basically as much info as possible or point me in the right direction of some good info. Thanks guys :love:

17-03-2008, 05:11 PM	#2 (permalink)
Wee G Gym Addict Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Inverness, Scotland Posts: 363	Re: CNS recovery Almost all overtraining / fatigue is neural. General symptoms... Drop in specific or general motor performance / loss of motor coordination Loss or decrease in specialised skills Irritability Change in sleep patterns / depth of sleep Loss of appetite Shift in resting heart rate Shift in bodyweight Change in mental outlook / depression / self-talk, especially combined with lethargy. "Nervous ticks" and crutch behaviour becoming more common. Change in libido (usually downward) Loss of concentration / focus Slower response / reaction times to stimuli Cloudy thinking Cheers, G

17-03-2008, 05:39 PM	#3 (permalink)
irwit is realising, diet, traing, rest, supplements, 12 egg breakfasts are nothing without consistency Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: London Posts: 505	Re: CNS recovery So serious overtraining does lead to serious problems then. So for example when training your cns takes a hit if you are overtraining or not. So is there anything else apart from adequate rest that can help speed up the cns recovery ? Im basically weighing up the pros and cons of either a push pull legs or 2 day full body split for my next routine. Am I right in saying your whole cns takes as much of a hit wether you have just finished a full body workout or a push day workout for example.

18-03-2008, 08:48 PM	#4 (permalink)
Wee G Gym Addict Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Inverness, Scotland Posts: 363	Re: CNS recovery Closest you will get to a rough approximation of CNS sttress directly from training is total load x some kind of "stress" co-efficient. For example you could go with reps x load = total load then... 1.0 = warmup, no stress 1.2 working set 1.5 = set to failure 1.7 = set + forced reps 2 = set to negative failure so a set of 10 with 100kg for a warmup = 1000kg total load x 1.0 = 1000 "stress units". A set of 8 to failure with 120kg = 960kg total load x 1.5 = 1440 "stress units". and so on. The co-efficients are basically arbitrary and determined by how you know you respond to training. For example if you know that you can do 1000kg total load with no failure, but in the same time frame you can only recover from 660kg total load when sets are taking to failure, then a set to failure needs to be "worth" about 1.5 times as much as a "warmup" set. In order to track like this you need a good training diary and experience, otherwise your co-efficients aren't based on anything and it's pointless. Regarding ways to enhance CNS recovery there are too many to list but here's a starter (credit to Mel Siff for this) Passive Physical Means Classical massage PNF (Neuromuscular means) Myofascial trigger point massage Acupressure/ shiatsu Hydrotherapy Stretching techniques Flotation Aromatherapy Therapeutic Touch Electronic technology Laser therapy Passive machines Vibromassagers Barotherapy (pressure) Balneo-therapy (baths) Reflexology Aromatherapy Active Physical Means PNF (Neuromuscular means) Self-massage (active/passive) Stretching Physical activity Recreational sport Manual labour Dance Play Postural realignment Breathing regimens Progressive relaxation Tai Chi Yoga Table B: PSYCHOLOGICAL MEANS OF RESTORATION Psychotherapy Hypnosis Autogenic training Operant conditioning Visualisation/ Guided imagery Sensory deprivation/modification Screaming/shouting Music/sound therapy Singing/chanting Meditation Religion Biofeedback training Neurolinguistic programming Laughter/tears . . . . . . . Cheers, G

19-03-2008, 01:15 PM	#5 (permalink)
irwit is realising, diet, traing, rest, supplements, 12 egg breakfasts are nothing without consistency Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: London Posts: 505	Re: CNS recovery Brilliant reply! Some really good info and ideas to work from in there. cheers mate :o) So CNS recovery is as much mental as physical then. Positive mental attitude helps the whole body in more ways than you might first think I guess. One point, one of your tips for helping CNS recovery Im not sure I fancy tryin is the Vibromassager ... leave that one for the mrs I think ;o) thanks again

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