Struggling to grow my middle Deltoid. Any advice? - UK-Muscle Body Building Community

Batesy · 08-09-2006, 02:58 PM

Hi Guys,

For a long time my shoulders have been the weak part of my lifting game. I never liked training them which is probably a big part why.

Anyhow they have been enjoying a big focus of my attention for the past 9 months, and I'm seeing good progress, but the middle deltoid seems to be lagging behind the front and rear and I don't know why as I'm trying to give this part more attention. I want a nice balanced round shoulder which peaks in the middle...

Here's the current shoulder workout from my 3 day split:

Overhead Dumbell Press 4x
Behind Neck Press 4x
Upright Barbell Rows 4x
Lateral Raises 5x
Bent Over Lateral Raises 5x

Previous shoulder workouts have looked very similar.
I'm going as heavy as I can to loss of form failure.
I have also been adding extra sets of lateral raises to the end of the other workouts as well so I've also been trying more volume.

I'm now thinking of adding lateral raises on the cable station to try and help but I'm probably not going to see much change. I think I'm missing something fundamental.

What do you suggest I do to try and plump up the middle head?

cheers,

Batesy

wiseguy83 · 08-09-2006, 03:22 PM

-Behind Neck Press-i would leave these out as they can cost you a bad injury if they are a must for you i would go nice and light and dont go all the way down.add some front raises

Dumbell Press 4x
front dumbell raises 4x
Lateral Raises 5x-superset-Bent Over Lateral Raises 5x
Upright Barbell Rows 4x-superset-dumbell shrugs 4x

this might be a bit much for you but i find the more intense i work my shoulders the bigger they get,but then again i train HVT style(drop the sets down if you like) i dont take much rest from set to set maybe 30seconds and i dont always strive to lift massive amounts of pounds i just go for the pump and a burn rep em out mate they will come

**hackskii** · 08-09-2006, 05:11 PM

Well, with any intensity It looks like overtraining to me.
I dont think you need the behind the neck if you do front military press. Not only that but the potential for rotator injury is increased.

The side delts get hit with side lateral raises.
Very them like, cable for a few weeks, dumbells, machine, think diffrent angles.

wiseguy83 · 08-09-2006, 05:17 PM

Well, with any intensity It looks like overtraining to me

lazy ass!!!!

what ever works for you hacks

Batesy · 08-09-2006, 06:07 PM

Wow! Only 5 posts and I've already bagged myself a Hacks!

Cheers Man! (I've lurked for a long time...)

The BNP is a fairly recent addition and I know the risks so I am careful. Having said that I can't see what it brings me over the Military Press so I might ditch it in favour of something else.

I'm intentionally not doing front raises at the mo because the anteriors are the best developed of the 3 currently and I think they get hit plenty with all the pressing exercises I'm doing so I'm not feeling the need to isolate them.

cheers for the suggestion Wiseguy, I've been running my current programme for a while now so it's time for a mix up.

Variations / angles seem to be the way to go and I think I will get into the cable station as one of the next steps.

Keep it comin!

Batesy

**Robsta** · 08-09-2006, 06:52 PM

I think with the lateral raises it's a lot to do with form, I see so many people nearly swinging the dbell over their shoulder when they do this.....just go heavy and go for the right form.....I like to turn my wrists down towards the end of the raise and then back again on the way down....
I find this hits my delts good and always get a good burn there......

**hackskii** · 08-09-2006, 07:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robsta9

I think with the lateral raises it's a lot to do with form, I see so many people nearly swinging the dbell over their shoulder when they do this.....just go heavy and go for the right form.....I like to turn my wrists down towards the end of the raise and then back again on the way down....
I find this hits my delts good and always get a good burn there......

Oh absolutly.
I cant see cheating on an isolation exercise

I see guys doing biceps and having bent arms the whole time.

I was taught that side laterals are done like you have 2 pitchures of water and you slowly poor them out as you raise them up.

I did them yesterday on cables and I use negatives when I do them, I find it does not aggrivate my shoulder as I dont have to go heavy.

**Robsta** · 08-09-2006, 07:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hackskii

Oh absolutly.
I cant see cheating on an isolation exercise

I see guys doing biceps and having bent arms the whole time.

I was taught that side laterals are done like you have 2 pitchures of water and you slowly poor them out as you raise them up.

I did them yesterday on cables and I use negatives when I do them, I find it does not aggrivate my shoulder as I dont have to go heavy.

Spot on mate....I try to explain to some people about pouring the water out as you lift but they can't seem to get it....bless them.....they look at me like I'm a loony

....I get up to 24 kg at the end of the exercise for 8-10 reps.....does burn tho'....lol

**hackskii** · 08-09-2006, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by robsta9

Spot on mate....I try to explain to some people about pouring the water out as you lift but they can't seem to get it....bless them.....they look at me like I'm a loony

....I get up to 24 kg at the end of the exercise for 8-10 reps.....does burn tho'....lol

Damn, that is stong, I dont think I have ever done that much ever.
Wow, respect..............:beer1:

**Robsta** · 08-09-2006, 11:05 PM

Cheers mate....I normally do 5 sets starting on 18's, then 20, 22, 24 then 24 dropping to 20......maybe up to 22 off cycle depending how strong I feel

bigdaftjoe · 08-09-2006, 11:12 PM

side laterals is one lift where i see some fcukin horrendous form in the gym stay light keep your palms facing down straight arm and lift try them seated as well, i see guys in the gym who appear to be......... i cant even explain it!

BIG-UNC · 09-09-2006, 09:57 AM

hey batesy mate

you dont need to go heavy on side laterals mate just keep your form spot on and they will grow!

when your doing them think of the jugs of water like rob & hackskii mentioned but when your at the top stay there for atleast 5 seconds with no cheating what-so-ever

these will make your shoulders look like melons mate

or do them on a bench..put it at its 45 angle lay on it and do them from there!!! fooking killers mate

the 2 excersises ive mentioned dont need heavy weights bud probably a lot lighter than you use now but dont get stuck in thinking you need to do these heavy mate cos you dont just very very strict form mate!!

tyr them for a month ill guarantee your side delts will grow!!!

**hackskii** · 09-09-2006, 04:23 PM

Testosterone makes my side delts explode

I am not suggesting adding testosterone to this mix but that is the first thing I notice when I take gear the shoulders automatically get bigger.

Batesy · 10-09-2006, 08:43 AM

Nice one lads.

Got lots of food for thought there. I'm definitely a form man and not into swinging (in the gym at least!) It's a pet hate of mine seeing the fancy haired boys cheating the hell and benefit out of their exercises.

I always now do my laterals seated (until my form goes) then I'll stand for the final set or so. I don't "pour the kettle on these ones" but I do that on the bent over version. I'll try to stay seated for focus and add the pause / twist for variety. Cables and Angles are also going to come in.

And if all else fails I'll jab some test into the bastards (damn you hacks I don't need this temptation!) (but if YOU say it's OK....) Hell I could even pump a load of synthol in there and get myself the "worlds biggest deltoids".

Naah we'll see. I reckon I've still got lot to come yet.

laters,

Batesy

**hackskii** · 10-09-2006, 05:52 PM

Haaaa haaaa, leave the synthol alone mate

That is a good idea though to do them seated then cheat the last couple, this will actually raise the intensity of that lift some.

Sorry about tempting ya on that test thing.
I was actually serious, the delts have some of the most androgen receptors in the body.
You can sometimes tell a guy is on gear by the size of his shoulder growth.
I am not kidding about exploding though.
One course I did they exploded and I wasnt really doing all that much for them, I was focusing on increasing my bench and they just took off, then I started hammering them.

But hold off on the test till you hit a plateau.
I dont even know how old you are.

08-09-2006, 02:58 PM	#1 (permalink)
Batesy Newbie Trainer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Newcastle Posts: 22	Struggling to grow my middle Deltoid. Any advice? Hi Guys, For a long time my shoulders have been the weak part of my lifting game. I never liked training them which is probably a big part why. Anyhow they have been enjoying a big focus of my attention for the past 9 months, and I'm seeing good progress, but the middle deltoid seems to be lagging behind the front and rear and I don't know why as I'm trying to give this part more attention. I want a nice balanced round shoulder which peaks in the middle... Here's the current shoulder workout from my 3 day split: Overhead Dumbell Press 4x Behind Neck Press 4x Upright Barbell Rows 4x Lateral Raises 5x Bent Over Lateral Raises 5x Previous shoulder workouts have looked very similar. I'm going as heavy as I can to loss of form failure. I have also been adding extra sets of lateral raises to the end of the other workouts as well so I've also been trying more volume. I'm now thinking of adding lateral raises on the cable station to try and help but I'm probably not going to see much change. I think I'm missing something fundamental. What do you suggest I do to try and plump up the middle head? cheers, Batesy

08-09-2006, 03:22 PM	#2 (permalink)
wiseguy83 Banned Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 273	-Behind Neck Press-i would leave these out as they can cost you a bad injury if they are a must for you i would go nice and light and dont go all the way down.add some front raises Dumbell Press 4x front dumbell raises 4x Lateral Raises 5x-superset-Bent Over Lateral Raises 5x Upright Barbell Rows 4x-superset-dumbell shrugs 4x this might be a bit much for you but i find the more intense i work my shoulders the bigger they get,but then again i train HVT style(drop the sets down if you like) i dont take much rest from set to set maybe 30seconds and i dont always strive to lift massive amounts of pounds i just go for the pump and a burn rep em out mate they will come Last edited by wiseguy83; 08-09-2006 at 03:26 PM.

08-09-2006, 05:11 PM	#3 (permalink)
hackskii UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sunny Southern California U.S.A. Posts: 24,445	Well, with any intensity It looks like overtraining to me. I dont think you need the behind the neck if you do front military press. Not only that but the potential for rotator injury is increased. The side delts get hit with side lateral raises. Very them like, cable for a few weeks, dumbells, machine, think diffrent angles. __________________ Scott

09-09-2006, 04:23 PM	#13 (permalink)
hackskii UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sunny Southern California U.S.A. Posts: 24,445	Testosterone makes my side delts explode I am not suggesting adding testosterone to this mix but that is the first thing I notice when I take gear the shoulders automatically get bigger. __________________ Scott

10-09-2006, 05:52 PM	#15 (permalink)
hackskii UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Sunny Southern California U.S.A. Posts: 24,445	Haaaa haaaa, leave the synthol alone mate That is a good idea though to do them seated then cheat the last couple, this will actually raise the intensity of that lift some. Sorry about tempting ya on that test thing. I was actually serious, the delts have some of the most androgen receptors in the body. You can sometimes tell a guy is on gear by the size of his shoulder growth. I am not kidding about exploding though. One course I did they exploded and I wasnt really doing all that much for them, I was focusing on increasing my bench and they just took off, then I started hammering them. But hold off on the test till you hit a plateau. I dont even know how old you are. __________________ Scott

08-09-2006, 05:17 PM	#4 (permalink)
wiseguy83 Banned Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 273	Well, with any intensity It looks like overtraining to me lazy ass!!!! what ever works for you hacks

08-09-2006, 06:07 PM	#5 (permalink)
Batesy Newbie Trainer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Newcastle Posts: 22	Wow! Only 5 posts and I've already bagged myself a Hacks! Cheers Man! (I've lurked for a long time...) The BNP is a fairly recent addition and I know the risks so I am careful. Having said that I can't see what it brings me over the Military Press so I might ditch it in favour of something else. I'm intentionally not doing front raises at the mo because the anteriors are the best developed of the 3 currently and I think they get hit plenty with all the pressing exercises I'm doing so I'm not feeling the need to isolate them. cheers for the suggestion Wiseguy, I've been running my current programme for a while now so it's time for a mix up. Variations / angles seem to be the way to go and I think I will get into the cable station as one of the next steps. Keep it comin! Batesy

08-09-2006, 06:52 PM	#6 (permalink)
Robsta UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In The Shire Posts: 6,411	I think with the lateral raises it's a lot to do with form, I see so many people nearly swinging the dbell over their shoulder when they do this.....just go heavy and go for the right form.....I like to turn my wrists down towards the end of the raise and then back again on the way down.... I find this hits my delts good and always get a good burn there......

08-09-2006, 11:05 PM	#10 (permalink)
Robsta UK-Muscle Moderator Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In The Shire Posts: 6,411	Cheers mate....I normally do 5 sets starting on 18's, then 20, 22, 24 then 24 dropping to 20......maybe up to 22 off cycle depending how strong I feel

08-09-2006, 11:12 PM	#11 (permalink)
bigdaftjoe poon star Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: sunderland Posts: 1,310	side laterals is one lift where i see some fcukin horrendous form in the gym stay light keep your palms facing down straight arm and lift try them seated as well, i see guys in the gym who appear to be......... i cant even explain it!

09-09-2006, 09:57 AM	#12 (permalink)
BIG-UNC IF YOU BUILD IT.....THEY WILL COME! Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: middlesbrough Posts: 1,945	hey batesy mate you dont need to go heavy on side laterals mate just keep your form spot on and they will grow! when your doing them think of the jugs of water like rob & hackskii mentioned but when your at the top stay there for atleast 5 seconds with no cheating what-so-ever these will make your shoulders look like melons mate or do them on a bench..put it at its 45 angle lay on it and do them from there!!! fooking killers mate the 2 excersises ive mentioned dont need heavy weights bud probably a lot lighter than you use now but dont get stuck in thinking you need to do these heavy mate cos you dont just very very strict form mate!! tyr them for a month ill guarantee your side delts will grow!!!

10-09-2006, 08:43 AM	#14 (permalink)
Batesy Newbie Trainer Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Newcastle Posts: 22	Nice one lads. Got lots of food for thought there. I'm definitely a form man and not into swinging (in the gym at least!) It's a pet hate of mine seeing the fancy haired boys cheating the hell and benefit out of their exercises. I always now do my laterals seated (until my form goes) then I'll stand for the final set or so. I don't "pour the kettle on these ones" but I do that on the bent over version. I'll try to stay seated for focus and add the pause / twist for variety. Cables and Angles are also going to come in. And if all else fails I'll jab some test into the bastards (damn you hacks I don't need this temptation!) (but if YOU say it's OK....) Hell I could even pump a load of synthol in there and get myself the "worlds biggest deltoids". Naah we'll see. I reckon I've still got lot to come yet. laters, Batesy